Koenigsegg's alleged business plan for Saab leaked

I wonder about selling a "new 900" during the "premium phase." The 900 isn't a premium car, so fear some retro-premium effort that's more of a fashion statement than a serious car.
The real way to make a "new 900" is to make a car that offers novel solutions and great practicality at a price regular families can afford.

Any word of a smaller car?

They classic 900 may not have been a premium car, it sold at a premium price. Saabs have -especially in the 1980's- always been more expensive than comparable Volvo's, Alfa's and even BMW's. If that helps the brand to survive, I'd be pleased with that!

I do worry about employment, though!

What's this 2012 9-5 Konne- edition? Can't wait to see that.

No 9-x / 9-X Air or 9-1 plan?

I wonder what SAAB dealers will think about this plan,they invested quite a lot in their accomodations to sell more cars.Be prepaired for more.

Now SAAB is planning to sell less SAABs but more expensive. ???

Hm, if this is their plan, then goodbye SAAB! Nobody will pay premium money over similar BMW or AUDI for a SAAB. And 65 000 cars a year... How? Just 9-5, 9-5SC and 9-4X will account for more then that, where's the new 9-3, 9-1, 9-3X...?

What this means is that, possibly, there will not be a 9-1 or maybe not even 9-3 in the future, but only upper market cars like 9-5 and 9-4x. Which actually makes sense for a business plan they're proposing, since you can make much more money from selling a larger, more expensive car.

9-5 K-segg edition sound nice... Weight saving techniques/materials and more poweaaa, please!

Thats good. Just according to my wish.

I am assuming correctly that "Koenigseeg edition" will become to SAAB what is M to BMW and AMG to Mercedes-Benz? If so, I sure hope so they have learned something from Volvo's fiasco with the R series.

9-1e, please.... where is it...???

However, I think the average price in the present phase is mostly a realization of the hard climate selling a Saab over the next few years. Both customers and dealers are wary, and it will require a price incentive to get the cars rolling out of the showrooms... ?

These are clever people, so I guess (hope!) they have their flanks covered. I believe the 50% increase in average price is only numericals of finance plans, not directly related to the perceived value and market segment, more than they will try to increase the exclusivity of the brand, a bit... Also, count in (massive) inflation and things look more reasonable. I think in NA the street price for a Saab was less than 80% of MSRP, a few months ago.

I think the plan, if the leak is real, looks rather good, save the lacking 9-1(e).

I hope it is possible to make Saab to a brand above Audi and BMW. In some way similar to Porsche. A new Saab Aero Cab with the equipment I want cost about 50000 EUR to-day. An Aero Sedan will cost nearly 40000 EUR. A new Saab should be a brand for very few people and in ten years to an average price of 50000 EUR and max 30000 cars a year. Of course the quality of Saab will be much, much higher than to-day. Sorry, not for 'normal' people so we have to buy a used Saab.

It makes sense for Saab to move further upmarket, to around Jaguar levels perhaps. If we want Saabs engineered and manufactured in Sweden that's the only way the brand will survive. You have to keep in mind, during the GM era Saabs went downmarket where now they sell at prices often comparable to VW.

I'm not a big fan of the "new 900" idea, sounds like trying too hard. Sure, make a hot hatch, but don't call it a 900. I like the Koenigsegg Editions, though. Saab needs it to establish credentials against the M series, AMG and Audi's RS.

I posted this in the "saturday morning Banglebutt" thread as I found some comments on this story there. I hope no one minds too much for me reposting my comment here.

Since this is (supposedly) an internal document the quoted prices are most likely net i.e. what Saab Auto gets for each unit sold. What the customer might or might not pay is of no interest whatever to the bottom line.

I must make my ignorance public and say: I have no idea how much dealers add on to the manufacturer's price and what sort of discounts are hurled at buyers. I would also assume that these vary from country to country. Anybody out there got an idea?

Re. the plan itself: I think it sounds good. Some of you may have noticed that I have been against the K-segg deal. However, they have managed to get the whole thing this far despite the flack, and one can really only admire the guys.

The so called "current phase" is in my opinion a bit dicey. Current sales are maybe 30.000 units / annum. The 9-5 is to boost these to 115.000. I tried to find post-launch sales of the old 9-5, but was unsuccessful. Anybody have an idea of the numbers sold world-wide when the old 9-5 was a new car and what share of total unit sales did it have?

It is probably well founded, the idea of reducing volume and increasing prices. And with the right ideas the cars will probably be good enough to defend the prices.

But, they will definitely lose me as customer. I am not interested in luxury cars, even the 9-3 was on the borderline of what I though was acceptable to put in a car.

When I look at what the DI newspaper wrote this for me personal is not everything in the main financial plan. For me it feels that there are more to it. We have to remember that we don't have all the facts. There will probably be more models than what we perhaps got to know about here.

We can be positive or negative to this. But also remember that this is the finacial plan to show how they want to make the company profitable out from some numbers. We don't know if they might change it when/if the start to make money.

Let's just keep focus on the final signature on the deal instead. :)

I am a swede but spend some time in Spain. For about 5 years ago Saab was imported to Spain by Porsche España and distributed by Porsche handler. To-day it is GM (Opel) who is the handler. When it was imported by Porsche it had the status it must have in the future. To-day it is a shame to see how Saab is handled by Opel. I think we have to wait and see which the distributer all over the world will be. I am convinced that they will be fewer but hopefully better.

My thoughts on this.

That is a credible business plan I'd say. There is no point going after the mass producers or the less than mass premium producers. Either route is in reality impossible to achieve in the short term (5-10 years).

Targeting the upper premium / luxury segment is the only way forward unless your aim is to ship the whole lot over to China within 5 years (implying going for the mass market).

I would have thought the best business plan for Saab would have been to slide in under the premium brands and make a niche just under, a sort of "sub-premium." That's how I always felt they were in the heydays of the '80s.

I feel that the GM years may have tarnished their reputation enough to add the "risky" to the "reliable but risky" that we've heard so much about. BMW, Audi, MB, Porsche have never had a perception issue like Saab has under GM as its "loss making subsidiary."

It may be risky to try to turn that around in just a few years.

But I'm just a graphic artist, I'm not a business manager.

Let's just hope, that if this is the real plan, that the world economy comes back enough to let it happen. It'll have to.

Man, a Saab 9-5 KE would be cool as hell.

I was very little in the early 90's, but wasn't the 9000 a really expensive car? I can't find actual numbers but wasn't i up there around $35k (USD)? That was A LOT back then, and I'd say it was a premium brand compared to what others offered in the 80's and early 90's.

I wouldn't mind if Saab went more upscale. They need to, and if it means charging a little extra, so be it.

Some pricing comparisons, for the Dutch market. In other modelyears, the differences were even bigger (will post another comparison later!)..

Modelyear 1987
[b]Base-models:[/b]
Alfa 75 1.6: fl. 30.990
Audi 80: fl. 36.365
BMW 316: fl. 35.000
Citroën CX: fl. 40.875
Peugeot 505: fl. 32.190
Volvo 240: fl. 33.800
[i]Compare to:[/i]
Saab 90: fl. 34.950
Saab 900 5-d: fl. 40.950

[b]Convertibles:[/b]
BMW 325i Convertible: fl. 77.820
[i]Compare to:[/i]
Saab 900 Convertible: fl. 95.950

[b]Big sedans:[/b]
Audi 100 1.8: fl. 49.295
Audi 100 Turbo: fl. 74.610
BMW 518i: fl. 45.300
BMW 520i: fl. 52.700
BMW 525i: fl. 64.260
[i]Compare to:[/i]
Saab 9000i: fl. 57.450
Saab 9000T: fl. 77.550

I wouldn't read too much into that lads, it's only a couple of lines. Having said that, if I was in charge of the company, I would not be pricing Saab against Audi/Merc/BMW, as they simply cannot compete with the sheer volume of cars, and indeed models, that are offered by these guys. Saab should create one vehicle that is priced against the 1-series BMW, but is in size similar to 3-series, and has enough varients to compete against all 1-series, 3-series bodytypes, all Audi A3/A4/A5 models, all Merc A/B/C/CLK models - which to me what the 900 was. It's not quite premium, but it's aside, by itself, and is therefore an option for all premium and non-premium buyers alike. Whatever they do, they need to be smart. The last thing that is needed is another Rover situation. The 75 was, after all, not the worst car in the world...

People need to remember that whoever would buy Saab would be someone who wanted Saab and who wanted to be in that market portfolio. It is true Saab AB was being divested from GM as a non-core asset haemoraging money according to some accounting tricks. These people are business people who got involved because they want to be here and secondly because they are in it for the money.

So the business plan ìs not for nostalgic overtures but to generate enough money to break-even, pay the EIB loan back and show some ROI to the shareholders. Thirdly, they have personal ambitions too - proving that they can resurrect a moribund entity but then inject their own herìtage into it to elevate it to a premium status. We should be careful in passing judgement on people who bought into this quirky experience to make money. Is this not what we clamoured for all along? As an example, I lust after a Maserati Quattroporte Ottocilindri but I can't even afford a used one. So if Saab goes upmarket, "tata ma chance for me china!" This will make a lot of us feel hot under the collar, but at least it will save Saab's bacon.

Enough with the critisism... why is it such a crazy idea that Saab can be a real competitor with BMW and Audi in the near future? If quality improves and design is good I see no reason why they cant give the others a run for their money

I very much agree with J Fan. Saab has to offer a segment by itself and in this way be an alternative for both the 'premium' brands and the 'subpremium' ones (like Volvo).

The last thing Saab needs to be is a second BMW. GM tried that road and failed.

It's in Saabs nature to have a right of existence without the need of a 'premium' label. That doesn't mean the prices shouldn't rice. Quality, first class safety and innovative technique comes at a price. As Jacob showed us Saab weren't a bargain in the sucessful years of the 80's. Off course, the game has moved on, but I can imagine rising the prices is the right decission at this moment when we want Saab to revive.

I fail to see how Saab would survive selling 65000 cars a year at the equivalent of USD41000 (the keyword there is selling not pricing!!). A fully loaded 9000T cost close to that much 20 years ago and Saab was still losing money. I think K-G is going to have to sell a huge amount of Saab to BAIC in the future to fund further development. I am somewhat pessemistic that this business plan is do-able but then again I am not a businessman so what do I know?

It will be a brand segment, it is a Saabment.

More important than price is the car! To pay more for the same car is no good...

189,000 SEK = 27,850 USD
Current base price for a 9-3 is 30,360 USD

It seems that if the average price per vehicle is going to be less than $28,000 then they are planning on reducing the price of vehicles, maybe to drive demand. If the average price per vehicle for the 9-3, 9-3x and 9-5 is that low they should be able to take sales away from Subaru with the 9-3x, bring people in who were considering VW, and if someone was looking at Volvo or Audi, they would have to really think about looking at a Saab with the amount they could save, or trade up from an A4 to a 9-5. All good things.

208,000 SEK = 30,650 USD
280,000 SEK = 41,250 USD

That is a Large jump in price in 4 years, which makes me think that they are planning on introducing some new technology. If by reducing price now can get more people into their cars, and they can show the masses that the quality and performance of their cars are inline with Audi and BMW, and then introduce new technology, they will probably be able to justify having an average price of $41,250. Saab also said they will be having a more average life cycle for vehicles so 2016 is also following the time line for a possible next gen 9-5, when you think about 280,000 SEK doesn't seem as bad.

As for the 65,000 units per year number, I wouldn't think they would try and reduce the number of cars they produce a year. If they can justify the price by 2016 I think they are trying to show that they will become more an more profitable as time goes on. If by 2016 they only need to produce 65,000 to break even and they are at the 115,000 unit level still then it is great news for them.

I think we're forgetting two important factors here.

1) What we can see at DI.se are no business plan, it's just tiny snippets of an alleged one. It's very hard to draw any conclusions from these sheer numbers without any arguments supporting them. Not no mention trying to guess which models will be offered.

2) The prices mentioned are average prizes. If they'll start producing electric cars, then these will probably be more expensive to produce than the "normal" variant due to battery cost etc. At least for a certain number of years in to the future. I think they will keep car models/packages that are still low enough to be bought through an ordinary company lease, but since it's average prices it's hard to guess what the model range looks like (and what they'll be charging for the 9-5 KE).

Electric 9-3. Good stuff!

I can't see anywhere that Koenigsegg really intends to lower production. What's wrong with better margins?

I think Saab has a good chance to be just as premium as BMW fairly fast, just in a different way; Saab is about substance, not surface (as most other Premium cars tend to be); There was a saying in Sweden in the eighties that during the worst day of winter, the left lane on the highways was called the "Saab lane". Which held a some amount of truth, as Saab could go safely at higher speed on unevenly slippery roads. (Speed traps during the winter were/are rare...). I think there are a lot of people that like the sleeper aspect of Saab.

And if there is anyone that could take Saab upmarket, there are few (if any) that are more credible that Koenigsegg to do it.

J Fan: What Saab needs to do is the opposite, build a car that compete with BMW 1 series but cost as a BMW 3 series. BMW produce about a million cars annually so they will always have the upper hand when it comes to production costs. The trick is to get consumers to pay more for less. If you need to offer them more to pay less you're in serious trouble.

JMC: What the consumer pays for a car and what Saab get payed for a car are two different things, these prices reflect the latter. I would expect that you have to add at least 30-40% to the price plus local sales taxes to the prices mentioned above to get the consumer price.

SaabKen: Ask any european about that and they don't understand what you're talking about. The trouble for Audi was only on the north american market and there was actually nothing wrong with the cars. The trouble was that some drivers were not used to having the pedals so close to eachother, then the media made a big deal about it. In Europe at the same time Audi had great success with sporty, turbocharged and four wheel driven cars.

@Johan:
I agree.
The prices we see here are not the prices at which cars are sold to consumers
I think these are the prices for selling cars to distributors/dealers, meaning that in the 2010/11 period SAAB needs to get paid an average 189k SKR for every car they ship out to a dealership.
By 2016, they want to increase cash flow per unit to an average 150% of 2010.
I think this sounds quite ambitious.

On the other hand, SAAB were required to present a business plan that will be viable even if the market will not recover and they will not be able to increase their market share, i.e. to sell many more cars than they sell now.
The "business plan" presented by Dagens Industri is what SAAB want the public to know about how they intend to meet these requirements, I guess.

The average price has to rise or there's no point in doing this. There's no way a niche car maker can survive without those margins. I like what I see.

I'm with Eggs 'n Grits - all electric 9-3, Yum!

Sounds the same as worst case scenario plan that was already leaked earlier.

*IF* this is a legitimate Saab plan, are we sure this isn't the official plan or just a proposed Course of Action (COA)? Somethings don't add up. For example, a typical vehicle production run takes 4 to 5 years. A new 900 would be in production for most of this period, so unless they expect really strong sales of a much more expensive vehicle, then the averages are way off. This is important since the EIB and Swedish goverment wouldn't have agreed to such a risky proposition. Furthermore didn't the K-Seggs folk said there would be no cross-branding between the two makes?

My instinct is this is a fan's wishlist, not a true business plan.

If indeed thats the plan....end for Saab is actually in sight...we won't make 2014... Maybe Maud is right... K-segg go lower.. not higher if you REALLY want to make Saab work..back to the Scandinavian basics..understated luxury with understated style...if not you should have stayed making 18 cars a year or then maybe you will be again... sooner than you think....

Premium SAAB - that is right direction!

'Here, Here' to the entrenchment in the premium segment!

And let's put paid to the notion of 'Scandinavian Basics' -- if that means 'cheap'.

That model works only when the production is outsourced to inexpensive labour enclaves (a la IKEA). If (as others have noted -- Brother Kroum etc.) we wish to maintain a Swedish production base then we better look to B&O, Hastens as our exemplars.

[Employment Gods Willing] you better believe I'll be putting a deposit down for that 'K edition' 9-5 in '12 :).

B&O is Danish! Have had their stereo equipment since 1986, wouldnt ever have anything else. :)

If this is the real deal then its only the summary. Interesting reading though and I'm glad there is a plan. The phases show some realism as well as ambition. There is no real chasing of volume which is good - more about the product and the range. Although I don't think the range is fullly outlined here either. Remember, the core of any business plan is units x average selling price. Thats all we're looking at here and the range of in-market prices will be quite a different proposition.

Stoked to finally see something, even if its not 100% yet. This in itself is great.

189'000 sek currently 30'000 aud.

I hope SAAB oz executives are reading this and making a new business plan. Believe the 9-3 should be positioned in the 35'000 to 50'000 aud bracket with improved warranty period.

A more streamlined model line up would help. On the other hand current private buyers must be in distress as depro is again in freefall.

K-Segg deserve a go and all business plans are subject to change due to external circumstances.

Well as everyone knows, electric cars w expensive battery packs will raise the prices on what was once ordinary price leves, and create a new exp-eco-segment. If saab wants to be in the front of new technology, it must sell its cars at a higher price, otherwise it left, right and center. With the BAIC possibly taking the low-mid end model segment, saab has to postion it self according to its owner-family. If we look beyond post 2016 i think with a strong brand, Saab can return to the mainstream segment with some cheaper models, without risking its enhanced Saab brand, and status. But for know, its all about building a strong brand that gives BMW and audi a run for its money.

Im worried, Saab is fearing very bad in New Zealand, we are now down to 2 dealerships!

Saab is not very well known in NZ and is not marketed to its full potential to create brand awareness.

I do not believe Saab in NZ will sell any cars if they bung up the prices. They can hardly sell the 9-3 now.

People dont want to pay a bundle of money for a car nobody has heard of. Doesnt really scream sucess or impress many does it?

Even myself am contemplating sticking with the brand once the prices go up. I simply wont be able to afford it.

If anything I believe that Saab should put prices on its 9-3 range down to attract interest and focus on selling a larger volume of cars at a lower price. More Saabs on the road means more brand awareness.

One last info...

GM changed its media.gm.com and now the media.saab.com disappeared!!!

regards

I think the SAAB go in this direction is correct, because the SAAB is a niche vehicle, unable to meet Audi / BMW sales, and even Volvo's sales are also quite far from bad, and only raise prices in order to have funds to develop the best possible safety technology and the latest technology to enhance their brands and grades, SAAB can link up Koenigsegg, maybe one day, Aero X also have the opportunity to create on the contrary, If SAAB go to manufacture cheap car, then in the near future will be to catch up with rival China

I think the plan is quite ambitious. As it is Saabs are over priced here in the US. 9-3s go for $35-$45 on the lot which is alot for a small car. I was interested in a 9-3 Aero Sportcombi and it was about $45k which blew me away. Id spend that on a BMW fist based on quality and reliability. I like SAAB design and always have but I think they always have tried to go beyond their position in the market. I see them more like a VW make. With so many choices here in the US Saab has its work cutout for them. Love the new 9-5 but I'm scared to know the cost for the Aero version. And no mentions of the 9-4x in this plan or in general lately. That vehicle could be a success here in the US. Its Cadillac counterpart is being splashed all over the place now and I see them appearing on the road. I can only imagine the SAAB 9-4x in the metal.

I wish SAAB well but they need to be realistic with the "premium" label....they just arent at that level which isnt a bad thing....VW is about to take over as number one in the world and their cars are nothing to run home about but they are all over the place and are affordable...in the deep recession we have here now that is a big plus and it looks like it will take years for us to recover at this pace...

I really feel for the dealer network with this plan.
The prices mentioned are ex SAAB and therefore need to be increased by 1.4 plus country taxes to find the retail customer price. Thus the retail prices will be cost ex SAAB plus 55% to 60%.Will SAAB be competitive and will they still have the same dealer network?
What SAAB needs is a 9.1 and volume. It always needed a small car. Audi have a A1 next year - are they wrong. No. Just look at the registration figures for Jaguar and Porsche.Do we really need more expensive cars in this market place.The recession is not over yet Ksegg!

Well, I can't see it. I can't see how Saab could possibly increase their prices given a) their frankly precarious financial situation, and b) the product. A trust needs to be built up before Saab can command higher prices. Take Hyundai/Kia. Ok, it took them a while, but the new cars are great, they offer huge warranties and all for a price that's below the opposition. Ok, Hyundai is a HUGE company, and Saab isn't. But Hyundai have *won* people over, and did it the hard way by making good honest decent cars, with none of the marketing rubbish or design-queues. The reward is that right now, they are selling well when others are floundering. In fact two new Hyundai Sonatas were bought in my family in 2008, and both were bought at Saab's expense. The 9-3, which was €10,000 more than the Sonata couldn't compete - in fact it didn't get near. So, I will be in the market for a 9-5 when it comes out, but I know there are going to be compromises with it. I know I won't be getting the engine I want. I know that it's not rwd. I know that the bodystyle probably won't be what I quite want. I know that the interior (probably) won't be as expensively finished as Audi/BMW/Merc. I know that the running gear is mainly GM, and I hate GM going back to some Opels that I drove years ago. But worst of all, I know for sure, that Saab is in a precarious state, and that's a fact - a fact that isn't afforded to Audi/BMW/Merc. I won't have to wonder with them, 'will they be still here in three years?' So, after all of this, if Saab turned around and said, 'ok, you have all of this, but we are going to charge you more than the equivalent Audi/BMW/Merc'. Sorry, but I couldn't do it. If on the other hand, like I mentioned, they were to create a new useful 900-like car that was 3-series sized and 1-series priced. I'd buy it. And I'd buy it even with the compromises. Yes, the Saab name is good, but they have to make it better before they can start charging a premium. That's where Volvo has gone wrong recently. They went head on with Audi/BMW/Merc in their pricing - at exactly the time they turned into Fords - and they've come up short. They're lost.

Ok like most have said we are not Business managers. But I must say and yes its my 2 cents which is worth just about that much. What I see from a business stand point if they think they can be profitable with just 60,000 units then yes if they sell 70-80,000 then for a stock holder thats wonderful. We are for the most part not taking in full account of just what we will get for a premium brand name. I agree selling more for more is great, And selling more for less sucks.
What is wrong with selling a K-segg edition of a Saab, after all they are the parent company, and I personally think it will sell well if we build a well made car that will compete with the Germans. If we do this then the Ksegg edition will put that final stake into the stronghold the Germans have. Don't get me wrong I love the Merc/BMW/ and even Audi's but would like to be able to stick it right up there noses. I am sorry for sounding a little bitter but in the states while under GM, Saab has taken a beating and most people think we don't have a world class car. The car does have its short falls and most can be blamed on GM not giving a S***. But the 9-5 and 9-3 still look good on the road.
JKing I just saw your post. I have a question because I sorta agree but disagree. If we were to really build the type of car that all of us here want them to build. Would you still buy a Bemmer

Doesn't sound good to me.

I'd rather like to see K-egg and Saab "bound" together like Lexus and Toyota in Toyota camp.

Lexus is making the real premium cars with smaller volumes and Toyota is making small, medium and large models with larger volumes.

The "prices starting from" models should be priced correctly against their rivals, neither too high nor too low.

If K-egg really wants to raise the prices of Saabs so tremendously, that's not a good thing. For example I have a company car which is 9-3 Sport Combi and there's a certain price limit for our company cars. I really wouldn't like to choose another car brand in the future if the prices of Saabs will raise tremendously. I'm not the kind of guy who likes to drive a Saab in private but another brand as a company car. They both have to be Saabs and currently they are ;-)

I quite like the Lexus/Toyota idea... here's my take.

Keep the SAAB as it is, near-premium brand with world class cars slightly undercutting germans on price, but offering more options standard. Include hybrids and all electric vehicles to lower C02 emissions.

Then take the SAAB range as a starting point, and offer rebadged and slightly redesigned cars under Koenigsegg badge. Sell them via SAAB dealerships, make them an exclusive accessory, handbuilt and all. Only offer top of the range engines and options, limited editions. Offer M5 and M3 trouncing performance and better exclusivity.

For instance, a slightly redesigned 9-5 powered by the K-segg 4.7 V8 and 500+ hp. Limited edition, partially handbuilt, priced between the Quattroporte, Panamera and M5, AMGs and similar cars.

seems to me that 9-3s are more around the $30,000 range in the US than the 35-45K you quote, and that 9-5s are approcx 40K. That said, Saab seems to me to fit in well as a sub-premium pricing out at 10-15% below the equiv. BMW or Audi.

But who are Saab's customers? I've read a couple of times that Saab buyers are perhaps the most loyal customers, along with Merc. My next door neighbour has driven a Saab since the late seventies: 900,900,9000,9000,9-3,9-3,9-3. He's a retired bank manager who keeps to himself. I can't imagine that he's be too impressed with any Koenigsegg association, and for that matter, neither would I, and neither would my Dad/brother - all of whom are previous Saab owners/potential Saab owners. There's no way I would buy a Saab 'Koenigsegg Edition' - for the same reason that I would never put huge alloys on my car, or put racing stripes on it.

IMHO it will be necessary to look into both directions and make attractive offers to new target groups without neglecting the loyal customers.
And if they really go premium, they should get it right this time: they should start to offer premium quality and premium service BEFORE they start asking premium prices!

SAAB need to enrich their own cars, 9-1, 9-x air, 9-4x, 9-3, 9-5, Aero X, alone 9-3, 9-5 in any case there will not be a good prospect

Agreed with saabista63

a new 900 would be a blessed blessed event for myself. i only drive saab 900 turbos.

i take my saabs straight with a bit of punch. so if they rolled out a new 900 and it fit the bill, id be there, so there.

working in the auto industry, i wonder thought about these concepts of price and if they will even still apply a year or so down the road with the economy and everything else going on.

Sell rebadged Saabs under k-segg name? I dont think so. Rebadging is not the right method for Saab's (or any other car maker's) success as learned with GM and the demise of olds, pontiac, etc. Rebadging doesn't fool anyone. The 9-7X, or lexus' minimal sales of their rebadged Camry, the ES only destroy the brands integrity.

Oh well. I will be happy to look at those great premium Saabs but that's the end of the road for me with Saab. A 5dr Ford Focus turbo diesel looks good for an eventual replacement for the 9-5. Of course it's smaller, but I will need less place by then. Bye bye Saab. I've given enough towards your development, now let the rich take over.

Audis high end models are made by Quattro (not to be confused with the quattro branded four wheel drive), BMW's by M and Mercedes by AMG. Porsche also built a model for Audi, the RS2. The price difference between these models and the base model can be huge, an Audi RS6 does for instance cost more than three times the base price of an A6. To offer a high end version by Koenigsegg would be no different.

In the automotive industry there are two ways to survive. Produce larger numbers of cars for a low price or produce small numbers of cars at a high price. To survive on the number of cars Saab produce the cars must be expensive.

Under the GM era Saab has mainly sold entry level premium vehicles based on GM components. This have not been successful, and on the longer term Saab is also losing the possebility to use cheap massproduced GM components.

From that I think it's obvious what Saab must do to survive. They need to offer more high end cars and increase their prices so they can survive on lower volumes. Trying to beat the bigger manufacturers by price is not going to succeed in anything else than a bankrupcy.

In Sweden 280k SEK probably means a customer price around 500k SEK. With brands like Lexus which sell about a half million cars per year I would expect that average car price is already above that level if we look at IS/GS/RX models. That should give some idea what Saab need to offer for prices in that level.

Come on, guys, show some realism here.

"Keep the SAAB as it is, near-premium brand with world class cars slightly undercutting germans on price, but offering more options standard."

You want world-class cars built in Sweden with more options yet cheaper than the Germans. Which land do you guys live in?

If you want world-class cars loaded with options get ready to pay for them.

I'm surprised so many of you confuse break even numbers with reaching a maximum number of sales. Obviously K-Egg group will not settle for break even they want profit. I'd think they are aiming for 200,000 cars in a few years.

I do however, agree with those that call for a smaller car not because Saab needs to compete in that market but rather needs to recruit new fans, You drivers will not be able to get into 9-5s and unless Saab can find affordable ways for younger generations to drive their brand they will die with their rich and loyal Saabistas, anybody out there?

Grumpy +1

Like other premium makers are doing right now. Smaller cars smaller displacement Turbocharged engines -> better economy is the way to go.

Small SUV/SAV/Crossover - whatever seqment seems to be growing:

Audi -> Q5, BMW X1, Volvo XC60, Merc GLK and every Korean manufacturer and their brother are offering new cars in this class. 9-3x is a good start, but is it enough? 9-4x? Maybe with 1.9TTiD, who knows?

Reaching break even means no bankrupt, right? But still no profit and will not keep owner happy.

...and still the ONLY way to help Saab is to buy a new Saab. Every day I´m trying to figure out how...

Thanks, Carl, for being the first one to explain the declining production figure.. it seems most people were very confused!

The lower this figure, the better, because its not total production.. no manufacturer wants to limit this, nor knows this figure, unless it is a limited run vehicle. The 65,000 vehicle figure refers to how many cars they need to sell to break even in costs. Would you prefer to have to sell a MINUMUM 25,000 cars to cover your costs and make $0, or a MINIMUM 100,000 cars to make $0?

Also the increase in price is so large in a short time span because, aside from an increase in stickers across the board(which sometimes needs to be done to increase sales in a certain segment.. there are psuchological aspects here), they must be planning on A)selling a higher percentage of 9-5s than before(maybe more 9-3 verts, too.. aso XWD 9-3s are more than non XWD, ect.) and B)introducing new models that would sway that figure higher(take 9-4x, for example.. it will surely be priced closer to the 9-5 range than the 9-3 range).

Kroum: "You want world-class cars built in Sweden with more options yet cheaper than the Germans. Which land do you guys live in?"

Of course. As far as I know, the salary costs are lower in Sweden than they are in Germany. Plus: currency advantages/disadvantages. Currently Swedish crown makes it worthwhile to export goods from Sweden. But don't know how it's gonna be in the future...