9-5 < 120 g/km? Yes we can.

Further infos for the 9-5 MY ’12 are beginning to surface. And what the guys in Trollhättan do is incredible.

The people from Ynnor AB have tested today the new 9-5 SpotrsCombi.

First the SC, the rear seats will have 10 -15mm more headroom. They have compared it against the V70, A6 and 5-series, and it seems to perform at least as good.

The interior materials (no photo)have been upgraded for both SC and Sedan.

And now the (new) engines. There will be a 136 hp diesel added to the current 160hp and 190 hp diesel engines. The two smaller diesel will stay below 120g/km (maybe the Sedan only, maybe both).

And now the concluding words from the article.

The world premiere is located at the Geneva Motor Show. Then open the order books and after the summer may be the first customers of their cars.
After some tortuous km outside Trollhättan, one can conclude that the new 9-5 SportCombi has every chance to take back market share in the segment.
It is on par with or better than several of the class’ top sellers on several points. It is a distinctive car with a host of premium features. Merchants guarantee the residual value at lease customers. It will be hot game among families with children in the secondary market, if not already the new vehicle.

Jacob
Guest
Jacob
5 years 7 months ago

Wow! That sounds almost too good to be true. A sub 120g 9-5 is quite amazing! But doesn’t it say that it isn’t know exactly when the sub 120g will be introduced? So it could be in the year 2012 (not MY12)? “Exakt när det blir vill inte Saab säga i dag.”

I’m very curious about the update interiormaterials…

Carl-Henrik
Guest
Carl-Henrik
5 years 7 months ago

Well, the article states that the sub 120g CO2 engines is for MY2012.

There will also be a lane departure warning system, start/stop-system and more.

Michael
Guest
Michael
5 years 7 months ago

Great to hear that interior materials are upgraded! That’s very important, because the current interiors are maybe the biggest flaw in Saabs.

Michael
Guest
Michael
5 years 7 months ago

Of course I mean materials, colours and options, details from GM parts bin. Design and forms are great as always. 🙂

Swade
Member
5 years 7 months ago

Absolutely everyone should read that report. Even with Googletrans it’s very encouraging.

RS
Guest
RS
5 years 7 months ago

Swade, eight posts in one day! Weren’t you going to take it a bit easier? 😉 Please don’t leave us now when things are getting really exciting again.

RS
Guest
RS
5 years 7 months ago

My bad. Looks like I can’t either count or read (today). Sorry Red J.

TurboLover
Guest
TurboLover
5 years 7 months ago

Think about it RS: You belived Swade wrote it, but it was Red J,
i.e. Red J writes like Swade. That is the finest compliment you could give somebody in the Saabnut world when it comes to wrting texts! 🙂

RS
Guest
RS
5 years 7 months ago

I guess so and I have to admit that I’ve made the same mistake a few times before 🙂

Phoenix
Guest
Phoenix
5 years 7 months ago

Fully agree on the interior! From what I could see it looks almost like the panel they showed for the first time when presenting the 9-5. Just wonder why they can’t be fitted earlier than MY12.

Doctor Donk
Guest
Doctor Donk
5 years 7 months ago

When does MY12 start? sep. 11?

GerritN
Guest
GerritN
5 years 7 months ago

Fiscal year 2012 starts on October 1st in the US. I think new models for the next calendar year usually start becoming available in October/November.

Edis
Guest
Edis
5 years 7 months ago

July 2011: a model year is from july to june the following year.

Typically these cars are delivered to customers during the fall, from about august-september.

lala
Guest
lala
5 years 7 months ago

I just finished reading the swedish article and boy, that made my day… Makes me wanna be at Geneva as well 🙁

TurboLover
Guest
TurboLover
5 years 7 months ago

I can not see were it says that the sub 120 g will be only for the sedan?

Apart from that, sub 120g for such a large vehicle with 160 hp is… well… close to rocket science. I did not believe that was technically possible without hybridization.

It is gonna be sweaty for the the V70 in Sweden, that is for sure!

Troels, Denmark
Guest
5 years 7 months ago

Great reading!
Saab on its true way: Being among the leaders in technical innovation and evolution! 🙂

marvin
Guest
marvin
5 years 7 months ago
New information in this article (for me at least): 2 diesels below 120 g CO2/km (one new 136 hp). Difficult to say if that is only for the sedan, but since the article is about the combi and it only says “both will be below 120 g…” I actually believe that the are talking about the combi also. (Stop/Start maybe) Rear headroom increased 10-15 mm Better looking than the sedan according to some of the attendees New materials in the cockpit both sedan and combi from MY12 Adaptive Cruise Control (with auto start and stop) will become available It is… Read more »
Oscar Karlsson
Guest
Oscar Karlsson
5 years 7 months ago

Correct, there will be start/stop and the estate version will also have two diesels below 120g co2/km.

Here’s a short reviewof the new 9-5 estate, use google translate and you’ll see =)
http://automotorsport.se/news/22240/saab-9-5-sportcombi-provk%C3%B6rd–redan/

Pedro
Guest
Pedro
5 years 7 months ago

I’m still a bit worried that a sub-120g/Km car of the size of the 9-5 is too high geared; hopefully driveability won’t suffer too much.

GerritN
Guest
GerritN
5 years 7 months ago

Probably the highest gear has to be an overdrive.

Doctor Donk
Guest
Doctor Donk
5 years 7 months ago

You can hirsch or maptun it up to 210 HP and 450Nm. 136 is only for better sales (lower taxes), that’s not actual power engine can produce without significant loosing in MPG. This engine will be more than enough for diesel driver.

Ante
Guest
Ante
5 years 7 months ago

I like two sentences most:

“The biggest threat is the market’s fear of poor residual values, but it feels unwarranted”

“Sweden is obviously more boring without Saab”

Slobbo
Guest
Slobbo
5 years 7 months ago

I belive SAAB would use this in an advertisement!

“SAAB is alive and kicking, the world would be a more boring place without SAAB!”

=)

TuuSaR
Guest
TuuSaR
5 years 7 months ago

Hmm I wonder is the August version of the Combi MY11 or MY12? I would guess MY11.

Anyway, bit of cold shower for earlier 120g/km skeptics.

Michael
Guest
Michael
5 years 7 months ago

MY12, I think model year is changed mid-year, in summer as far as I remember.

TurboLover
Guest
TurboLover
5 years 7 months ago

Anyway, bit of cold shower for earlier 120g/km skeptics.

That is the kind of cold shower I’d happily take every day 😀

/ One of the former sceptics

turbokalle
Guest
turbokalle
5 years 7 months ago

Unbelivable!
I`d say this is the most important step for Saab on the way to success so far.

Mr.T
Guest
Mr.T
5 years 7 months ago

I agree, Ynnor AB is a company that advices the big companys leasing fleets

saab93f
Guest
saab93f
5 years 7 months ago

Yes, Saab apparently can!! It is great to be able to witness such great engineering spirit.

The report was very nice read – I liked the comment about 9-5 SC being on par or better than competitors. Well done Saab!!

J Fan
Guest
J Fan
5 years 7 months ago

Red J, you do an excellent job here too – you are always on top of things!

TurboLover
Guest
TurboLover
5 years 7 months ago

+1

GerritN
Guest
GerritN
5 years 7 months ago

+2

Oistein
Guest
Oistein
5 years 7 months ago

+3, can’t wait to order the new sport combi

Tomas TL1000R
Guest
Tomas TL1000R
5 years 7 months ago

+1 Our new Crown Prince!

Joe
Guest
Joe
5 years 7 months ago

What a beautiful article. Difficult to hold back tears reading the last sentence.

michaelb
Guest
michaelb
5 years 7 months ago

Sorry to disturb the party. For most purposes the 136 hp seems to be seriously underpowered for such a heavy car. 160 hp is great to have it with under 120g//km, will be fine for fleet sales, taxis etc. The most important model is the 190hp, as it will be combined with the XWD. Aside from that, great news regarding interior, start/stop,

Arild
Guest
5 years 7 months ago

In Norway the Volvo V70 with only 109 hp (and 119g/km co2) sells like crazy because low co2 emission and low power means less car tax. It was the second most sold car in 2010. So apparently horsepower isn’t everything.

MrY
Guest
MrY
5 years 7 months ago

We talk here about diesel and 300-350 Nm from very low revs is for most purposes beyond traffic light duells quite a sufficient trade off for most people when it comes to having to pay only 50 – 60 percent of the variable cost of the vehicle over life!

jos
Guest
jos
5 years 7 months ago
Don’t be too HP focussed, it is only relevant for top speeds. I have a 134HP 2.0i in my 9000 (1350Kg), I never found the car underpowered for my daily driving, only on holliday trips (600Km of autobahn @160Kph+ through Germany and uphill in the alps with family and luggage) the turbo in my 2.0t 9-5 makes a noticable difference. Furthermore, torque is more important on my opinion, and that’s alway better in diesels than in comparable gasoline engines. And if you like the power, then pay the higher tax, it’s not like the 136HP is the only dish on… Read more »
Stefan E
Guest
Stefan E
5 years 7 months ago

I don’t have the time to write much about it right now, but you are wrong. Power is for sure relevant for more than top speed. The easiest (but somehow simplified) way to estimate the overall performance of a car is by looking at the power/weight ratio.

jos
Guest
jos
5 years 7 months ago

Agreed, maybe I should refrase: Performance is not everyones key deciding point on a car. Good mileage and lower operating cost (including tax) are as much of the essence for some. And yes, someone with that preference can be a car enthusiast too 😉

Stefan
Guest
Stefan
5 years 7 months ago

jos, to that I can agree 🙂 I think that engine could sell pretty decent in some markets, for example highly taxed Norway and Denmark.

GerritN
Guest
GerritN
5 years 7 months ago

“by looking at the power/weight ratio”

Yes, but you have to do this as a function of rpm. Usually the HP curve peaks at high RPM, many times close to the red line. For normal driveability that’s kind of useless. Torque at lower rpm will make it feel like the car is moving with less effort and if the torque curve continues up (or even if it stays flat) until red line then that really puts a smile on your face.

Stefan
Guest
Stefan
5 years 7 months ago

Yes, GerritN, I know about that. I just wanted to simplify things a bit (as I wrote). You get much closer to the truth by talking about power/weight than torque/weight. And I of course see what you are after about the driveability, but I disagree to some point that the peak power is useless for normal driving. With an automatic you rev past the peak power at kick-down. And as for driving a manual and knowing how to use your stick it is useful too.

Stefan
Guest
Stefan
5 years 7 months ago
I guess I’m going off topic now and I know that you see what I mean, but I thought this was a convincing and interesting example. The acceleration figures are almost identical, despite signficantly higher torque in one of the setups. It is the same engine with two different programmes. The engine figures are measured, not calculated. All measurements were done at the same day. But here we are of course changing gears at about redline 🙂 Saab 9-3SC 1.8t, 285 hk, 380 Nm 0-60 km/h 4,1 s 0-100 km/h 6,9 s 100-150 km/h 6,2 s 100-180 km/h 12,7 s… Read more »
Edis
Guest
Edis
5 years 7 months ago

You can pretty much ignore the torque curve and only look at the power curve if it is performance you are interrested in.

It is power that makes the car accelerate

Power = Force * velocity
Force = mass * acceleration

more power = higher acceleration when everything else is equal

Saab
Guest
Saab
5 years 7 months ago

I still don’t understand the difference between torque and bhps…. I mean how can you have (at a certain RPM) a low torque: i.e. a low turning force from the engine and yet (relatively) many bhps? How come the torque curve is different than the hp curve is the real question… Maybe someone can enlighten me

Ken H
Guest
Ken H
5 years 7 months ago

Maybe we can say it like this:
Lot of HP will move you fast.
Lot of torque will move a heavy thing.
Lot of HP and torque will move a heavy thing fast.

milkylainen
Guest
milkylainen
5 years 7 months ago
This is my first post. I am only posting here just to enlighten you about the relation between torque and power. I regularly read all types of magazines and no one really seems to have a clue. So take my word for it. Power and Torque are the SAME (Physics 101), they are just constructs of different types of measures. If you have a Power curve over RPM, then you can always derive your Torque curve. This is how _ALL_ power benches do bench performance of an engine. If you have a Torque curve over RPM, then you can always… Read more »
Ted Y
Guest
5 years 7 months ago

Reply to milylainen: Thanks for commenting, and I agree with you. However, I think you meant ft-lbs instead of NM where the curves cross at 5252 RPM because T (ft-lbs) = HP x 5252 / rpm. Correct me if I’m wrong. I’ve also heard, to compare total performance of two engines, look at the area under either the torque curve or the power curve, and you get the same result either way.

Michael
Guest
Michael
5 years 7 months ago
Saab needs to sell cars. So they need a base version to state the magical “from” price that will be compared with others and they need lower emission cars to sell to corporate fleets in large quantities. Less power and less mass = lower emissions. I’d also like to see revival of Saab diplomatic sales. It comes from almost neutral Sweden so it used to be a usual choice for embassies and governmentel need all over the world. Also Saabs are very elegant and humble, which is good for diplomatc and governmental needs. I remember times when lots of 9000s… Read more »
Belfast_Saab
Guest
Belfast_Saab
5 years 7 months ago

Indeed, in the early 80’s Ireland’s PM drove a 900. I think the new 9-5 is an ideal vehicle given the space, presence but restrained styling, along with neutrality should be perfect for credit-crunch non-aligned countries around the world.

Talladegan
Guest
Talladegan
5 years 7 months ago

“The smallest are marching in a pleasant trot at 1100 rpm road speed.”

This was particularly pleasing to read as, to my mind, no car marches in a pleasant trot quite as well as a Saab.

Isn’t Google Translate fun 🙂

Joe
Guest
Joe
5 years 7 months ago

Price for 136hp TiD ought to be lower than 160hp TiD which today is one of the more affordable options, 1.6T gas aside? Lowers thresholds and makes it easier to compare/compete with VAG 140/170 diesel lineups.
Seems like we are looking at updated 9-5 interior at Geneva, doesn’t it?
Once again sorry VW for falling short in delivering sub 120g E-segement cars without compromising power. 105hp/140hp sub 120g will not cut it when small SAAB shakes 136hp/160hp out of their sleeve, and they haven’t even started.

Knape
Guest
Knape
5 years 7 months ago

Great news! I wonder what the sticker price would be…lower than the 1.6 T or higher? If it will be priced lower then, eaven with the extra combi cost, it would be a very big boost in sales to companies and such. At least that’s what I think. 🙂

lala
Guest
lala
5 years 7 months ago

month old video about 9-5 launch singapore, kudos to saab singapore!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sVR9Y7jBYs

GerritN
Guest
GerritN
5 years 7 months ago

Anyone know if there will be any tax incentives in the US for cars with low CO2 emissions?

Manlius
Guest
Manlius
5 years 7 months ago

I highly doubt it. There are none in place currently (to my knowledge) and given the current composition of Congress, I don’t see any new laws containing anything that might be even remotely called a carbon tax, energy tax, or CO2 tax being passed anytime soon.

Börjesson
Guest
Börjesson
5 years 7 months ago
Another big piece of good news in this very positive review is that for all five engines mentioned, the price will be below 7.5 “basbelopp” (which this year amounts to 321 000 kr), meaning that the car qualifies as a company car in the Swedish market. As long as a car stays under that magic limit, it doesn’t really matter much if it is 10 000 or even 20 000 kr more expensive than the competition. It is still in the running in that very important market segment, and within that group, most customers will probably choose their car based… Read more »
Börjesson
Guest
Börjesson
5 years 7 months ago

Oh, and one more thing I forgot to say:

Hats off to those incredible Trolls! Fan vad bra ni är! It’s just amazing what such a small number of people, a minnow in the automotive pond, can accomplish.

“Even the smallest car company can change the course of the future.” 🙂

Mr.T
Guest
Mr.T
5 years 7 months ago

+1, proud to be a saaber today!

JH
Guest
JH
5 years 7 months ago

This sounds very promising! 😀
I am very much looking forward to the launch of the Saab 9-5 SportCombi since it should substantially increase the number of 9-5s on our Swedish roads. That is especially true if the skilled Saab engineers manages to get the 9-5 below 120g CO2/km. That should really boost the sales and it should also be very impressive since the 9-5 is not a particularly small car! 😉

Pedro
Guest
Pedro
5 years 7 months ago

I missed the interior update bit… That’s sometjing I’m quite happy about, as the 9-5 might have suffered from the GM-Cheapness syndrome at lauch (remember the car was ready to launch when Spyker took over, no time for last minute changes). 😀

Johan
Guest
Johan
5 years 7 months ago

Apparently the new 9-5 Sports Combi have been test driven allready!
http://automotorsport.se/news/22240/saab-9-5-sportcombi-provkörd–redan/

Carl-Henrik
Guest
Carl-Henrik
5 years 7 months ago

Yes.. it’s in the 3rd row in this post… 😉
Swedish AMS just refers to the link in this post and saying in a nice way that they are envious not to be the first one to drive the car.

Johan
Guest
Johan
5 years 7 months ago

Yes, I was a bit quick there. Here is the direct link:
http://www.tjanstebilsfakta.se/bil/biltester/default.asp?page=specific&id=1000002

Marco
Guest
Marco
5 years 7 months ago
The car in the picture: Fordonsidentifikation Registreringsnummer: KKL782 Fabrikat: SAAB Färg: SVART Fordonsslag: PB Fordonsår: 2011 Fordonsslagsklass: I Chassinummer: YS3GR5BZ9C9000004 Typgodkännandenummer: Typgodkännandedatum: Senaste EU-regbevis del 1: 2011-01-18 Senaste EU-regbevis del 2: 2011-01-18 Handelsbeteckning: Upplysningar: Ägare/Brukare Namn: SAAB AUTOMOBILE AKTIEBOLAG Adress: Postnr: 461 80 Förvärvsdatum: 2011-01-17 Ort: TROLLHÄTTAN Försäkringsuppgifter Försäkringsbolag: ZURICH IRELAND LTD Försäkringsdatum: 2011-01-17 Fordonsdata Fordonsstatus: I trafik (2011-01-21) Tillfällig registrering: Nej Privatimport: Nej Antal ägare: 1 Yrkesmässig trafik: Nej Fordonet tillverkat: Producentansvarig: 556258-8912 I trafik första gången i Sverige: 2011-01-21 I trafik första gången i utlandet: Ägarbunden dispens: Ja Ägarbunden dispens upphör: Nej Besiktningsuppgifter Besiktningstermin: 2013-12-01 – 2014-04-30 Senast… Read more »
Jörgen Trued - SUHRT
Guest
Jörgen Trued - SUHRT
5 years 7 months ago
Exclusive test drive: Saab 9-5 SportCombi! As the first news outlet in Sweden, Business Car Facts received an exclusive test drive the new Saab 9-5 sedan, which comes with five engine options in the 7.5 base. Feverish work is also underway for two of the diesels will meet emissions below 120 grams CO2 per kilometer. Saab 9-5 SportCombi is hotly anticipated and necessary to lift the Saab to profitability. The biggest threat is the market’s fear of poor residual values, but it feels misplaced. The first hatchback versions of the new 9-5 roll of tape just before Christmas. After the… Read more »
Muppen
Guest
Muppen
5 years 7 months ago

Off topic:

Ever wonder how to change Xenon headlamps on a 9-5?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NoCyu0l62Y&feature=related

Peter
Guest
5 years 7 months ago
Hello, Do not know if this image has come up before, but the magazine auto motor & sport now has another spy photo of the new Saab car. Here’s the link: http://www.automotorsport.se/news/22215/saab-9-5-sportcombi–ny-spionbild/ The page you have written about before: http://www.tjanstebilsfakta.se/bil/biltester/default.asp?page=specific&id=1000002 says even though the test drive (which you may already have read) but translates a bit, anyway because it’s fun (of course through google translate :-)): We drove the wagon with both the 160 – to 190-horsepower diesels. The smallest are marching in a pleasant trot at 1100 rpm road speed. The gearing means you have to gear down to… Read more »
Oistein
Guest
Oistein
5 years 7 months ago

Nice site!

PatrikH
Guest
PatrikH
5 years 7 months ago

Just amazing what the SAAB engineers are capable of, it will be great to see the car on the roads.

Cokeisit
Guest
Cokeisit
5 years 7 months ago
This is great news! Hopefully that will help to get many more corporate cars sold. But I’m not sure the 120g is enough to sell more on the corporate market. This is my own personal reflections when building my new 9-5 on the Swedish site. I currently have a 9-3 SS MY08 and I have compared what I currently have and what I can get when ordering a new 9-5 SC (the SC will be 12000kr more expensive than the sedan). When I build a new 9-5 and choose the Vector package I don’t get electrically adjustable seats or the… Read more »
TuuSaR
Guest
TuuSaR
5 years 7 months ago

At least Swedish economy is doing very strong so people should buy more cars. Entirely other matter is what it will do for the currency value.

I think many will consider Saab as a “fake company” until it shows a profit.

Tomas TL1000R
Guest
Tomas TL1000R
5 years 7 months ago
Saab and Volvo is premium every where in the world but there are about 4 300 000 cars out there i Sweden. Nearly 1 000 000 is Volvos and about 400 000 Saabs, then it´s understandably that people in general dont think they are premium. If everbody have a Rolex on there arm should I buy a Rolex “to go premium”? Not so sure, premium is harder in a market where everybody has one. You get my point! We Sweds are a little bit scared not to afford our loved cars. Company cars are the solution I think. A <120… Read more »
peppie
Guest
peppie
5 years 7 months ago

Hi,

Next year I’m allowed to chose a new company car, and I had been driving saab’s since 1990, but 2 years ago, I couldn’t get one anymore because of the leasing companies. I hope in 2012 I can get a 9-5 sportcombi again, but then the <120 CO² issue should be there, otherwise I can forgot it again, and that is NOT what I want. Come on Saab, prove you are the number one again in innovation !!

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