Aprox 30 million missing

April 7, 2011 in Uncategorized

SVT VästNytt (west cost news) are reporting that the sum of aprox 30 million swedish crowns is the sum that SAAB owes the suppliers.

32 responses to Aprox 30 million missing

  1. Ouch. That’s less than $5 mil. Did not realize Saab’s finances are so dire. :S

    • True, but on the other hand, it’s nice that it’s not an astronomical sum. Just a cash flow problem really.

  2. I make that about 3 million pounds – is that such a massive sum for the car industry? Not small beer, certainly, but not an insurmountable problem considering the collateral SAAB can put up against further loans, not to mention the rising sales figures. Am I being too optimistic?

  3. about 3,3 mill euros – no problem for normal business.
    the problem is that SAAB has to finance the whole production,bringing out the car until they sold a car. if suppliers want cash and you have no sales goal of aprox 3 months it´s unfair to saab.

    • Yes.
      If the agreement with the suppliers ends up with close to CoD and at the same time paying due invoices it accentuates the problems.
      The worst thing is that if production goes up to meet a rising demand, as it should do, it also means further strain on the finances and liquidity.
      Hopefully there’s an agrement made that takes this into account.

      • This is a big problem for Saab, they need to raise production, but if they do this they need more cash to pre-finance the production.

  4. thats about 100 cars end user price …. not that world

  5. According to DN (a somewhat respected newspaper) a solution might be ready before the weekend. Saab must have talked to Svenåke Berglie (the representant of the suppliers), he sounds a bit happier today. http://www.dn.se/ekonomi/saab-tror-pa-snar-pengalosning

  6. According to this article, Saab normaly dpoduces and delivers a new car in 6-8 weeks contrary to 6 months for other brands, so that time minus the period of credit od Saab’s supplier should be the time that Saab has to wait for getting the money back for each car.

    • Can anyone confirm whether it os true that Saab delivers in 6-8 weeks (in Sweden?) and all the others (including Volvo?) needs 6 months? I find it hard to believe that it should be such a difference. =)

      • Niklas,6-8 weeks is the time I am waiting for my next Griffin. Many others have capacity problems and you have to wait 4months+ for your ordered car.

        • That’s also about the same time frame I was given when I ordered the 9-3 Independence Edition a few days ago. I fully realize at this point any “quoted” chronology is a guestimate at best. But I should see it on this side of “the pond” by mid July if not earlier.

      • My 93 Sportwagon is a stock car, ie I did specify it at the dealers.

        Manufactured Feb 2011, collected from dealer 25th March 2011.


  7. Hope everything is sort out soon.

    • Just hoping for things doesn’t make them happen! But I do hope as well…

      • Hey Timmy, what are you hoping for then???
        Maybe we should hope for VA, lubing the money pipe line…
        The interview with him seems good, he really enjoyed his 9000 Aera (!), now he is hooked on the brand – give the man a chance!

  8. Very sorry to have to inform you about this, but below are the publicly known FACTS in Sweden according to Swedish media

    a) SAAB debts to suppliers are today about 100 million SEK “Saab Automobiles obetalade skulder till underleverantörerna uppgår till omkring 100 miljoner kronor. Det säger ordföranden för underleverantörsföreningen Fordonskomponentgruppen, Christer Palm”

    b) SAAB has delayed repayment (by legal measures in courts) for a debt of 110,7 million SEK to the Swedish State. SAAB has so far lost its case in all previous instances, but still appeals to higher courts.

    c) one unpaid debt, now long overdue of 25 million SEk, This debt can today be interpreted as the FIRST public signal, that SAAB was running out of financial means, I cannot see how SAAB could possibly win this case, based on present Swedish laws.(Quote: 20 jan 2011:”Fastighetsägaren Platzer har stämt Saab Automobile som sedan i somras bara har betalt 25 procent av hyran för växellådefabriken i Göteborg. Skulden är nu uppe i 25 miljoner kronor”).

    d) SAAB also has a large unpaid debt to its advertising agency, a number of million SEK (my guess)

    SAAB chances to win legal cases b-d are by many considered small, but SAAB wins time to solve its financial problems. But that time by legal measures is probably also running out for SAAB within the next six months.

    So it´s not about 30 Million SEK. More likely about 250 – 300 million SEK,

    • if it´s 300000mil SEK it´s still only 33mio Euros. and approx 1200 cars.
      It´s not that amount of money you can´t borrow from other sources .

      keep calm and carry on

    • a) That’s an estimation, not a FACT, as well as 30 million is an estimation. I don’t know which source to trust the most, but 30 million is the number that is reported most. Also, it’s not public whether these debts are long overdue or not. Of course Saab buys parts for many million SEK each day as cars aren’t cheap to produce.

      b) Saab has previously stated that the 110,7 million are being held in a separate account and can be paid anytime, but obviously they want to appeal to higher courts as the outcome of the case is still unclear. Maybe this has changed, I don’t know.

      c) That’s a result from the reconstruction process in which all debts were written down by 75 %, but I agree that Saab is acting weird on that case.

      d) I’d also guess about one to several million SEK on this one, but it’s a guess and not a fact.

      So we’re talking about anywhere between 40-300 million SEK. I don’t know and you probably don’t know either.

      • Also, I forgot to mention that 25 % of the 110,7 million was paid last year, so even if Saab loses the case we’re talking about approx. 80 million SEK.

      • and its the worth of the end users price from produced cars of 4 days !!!! what are we talking about.

        the suppliers shoot themself with their action.

  9. Yes we know about the b-d cases.
    And they will be decided within the next 6 months.
    The 110.7 million is a tricky case so Saab might win that one yet

    I am not sure if the 100 mill is the total debt or if it the due debt.
    The numbers and the formulations are a little vague.
    But it is possible and plausible.

    But one thing that is a more important is that EVERYONE including the suppliers are now putting pressure on NDO to have them make a decision.
    Which may also be the reason that the Media has gone a little more quiet.

    We are still waiting for the decision of the Suppliers.
    They are also a nervous bunch at the moment due to their own strained economy, but if they can see a possibility for Saab to keep on existing longterm with more investors, I think´that the agreement may be better than expected.
    Their problem is that they are also dependant on Saab for their companies to grow.

    So it is still a complex situation that CAN be handled and taken care of.

  10. Just get this mess out of the way so Saab can continue bringing out the message of the new 95 SC and the 94x already!!!!!!!

  11. Yes not much we can do but hold fingers crossed for some more Muller Magic (or rather Saab Magic) to solve the current problems at least until VA can join. There is so much potential in this company, and so close to have the new models rolling out and helping the sales to finally take off.

  12. a) The FACTS:
    The Chairman Christer Palm of the Organization of Scandinavian Suppliers to the Automotive Industry informs Swedish Radio today, that after his investigation among members of this organization, the total sum of SAAB´s due but unpaid invoices is about 100 million SEK,

    If Christer Palm is a lier, and does not himself have FACTS behind such a public statement on behalf of his organization, then 100 million SEK is an assumption. But until he is proven a lier, I take his words, based on his position in this special case as FACTS.

    • Totalt bedömer Fordonskomponentgruppen att det handlar om 100 miljoner kronor i skulder till de största leverantörerna.

      They are estimating. The headline is a journalists interpretation

    • Again, Saab buys parts for maybe 30 million SEK/day (based on 250 cars being made/day and parts cost of 120,000 SEK per car, rough assumption). Three days of deliveries while production is stopped then equals 90 million SEK. If Saab just postpones paying deliveries for three days and meanwhile don’t get paid for cars delivered (because they aren’t being made), you get a very quick build up of debt. Maybe it’s “only” 30 million in long-term unpaid debt? I don’t know and I’m not directly contradicting you, but I for sure know that what we are talking about is speculation, not facts.

      Svenåke Berglie and Christer Palm work for the same organisation so they obviously have about the same insight in the business.

    • If it costs 50K SEK in parts to make a 9-3 or 9-5… That means Saab has made 2000 cars out of 100M SEK worth of parts.

      2000 cars is what…? Less than a month’s worth of production? (I seem to recall Saab makes about 250 cars per day? So even if the cost is 25K in parts, it still is not a significant number of cars)

      If Saab has 90 days to pay the bills, then I am not quite sure how these numbers add up. Unless Saab pays some suppliers up front and others nearly not at all. But a recent report from a credit rating company states that Saab is better at paying their bills on time than the average Swedish company.

      BTW: I welcome facts, but I have no need for you or anyone to speculate about who is telling the truth or not.

      • +1 Rune.
        Folks- Saab will be ok and the problems will be dealt with. This won’t be easyso lets not panic and turn on our favorite car maker or it’s leaders and hence, make it that much harder. If you must, save the speculation for another site.

  13. Difficult to draw any conclusions from something quoted in a newspaper article. Remember also that all car manufacturer make it a habit to build up debts by paying bills late, so it is not clear if part of these estimated 100 M SEK are the same debts that all the competitors build up.

    All we know is still that Saab neeed more money and they need i t fast, but they are working on it and they have Muller on board and he has dome miracles before.