Final closing of NEVS deal, delayed…
August 1, 2012 in News
Yesterday was the deadline for when the closing of the purchase of Saab Automobiles assets by National Electric Vehicle Sweden AB was supposed to come to a closing. This did not happen as some issues surrounding things in the deal have not been completed. Mikael Östlund, press-manager at NEVS tells TTELA that the closing of the purchase is delayed for a month, perhaps more but it will be completed this summer and that NEVS will get back to the public once the papers have been signed and not before.
We heard already on the day of the announcement of NEVS purchase of Saabs assets that there was an enormous amount of work left to be completed before the final take-over. NEVS have come to an agreement with Hemfosa which holds the key to the properties and the payment to Hemfosa will take place at the same time as the payment to the bankruptcy-administrators.
Clearly a deal like this is not done at the push of a button, as we’ve learned over the years, important business-agreements take time, lots of time to develop so that not mistakes are made.
As always, we wait and see! =)
Xon said on August 1, 2012
We are all waiting for nothing. SAAB is dead!
Mihai said on August 1, 2012
I have the same feeling which is very unfortunate as I absolutely love my SAAB. I have already started lurking the BMW forums to familiarize myself with the brand as that will most likely be my next purchase.
JasonPowell said on August 1, 2012
Sideline comments like this do a lot of good. If it were YM, BMW or any other buyer and this came out I doubt this would be your comment. Because we don’t know enough about the structure of this deal, it’s easy to be an armchair quarterback and make these types of comments. I don’t pretend to know everything about this deal and I don’t think anyone can say they do but I do know that these things take time and all I can do is wait. Maybe this is a good thing, maybe not so much but unlike the guy in the states that had predicted the end of the world a few months back, I don’t see the good in pretending that I know things that I simply don’t. I know there will be a lot of doomsday type comments to this post but really what’s the point?
Mihai said on August 1, 2012
It is called reality. Maybe we should start censoring negative posts and only approve rosy comments.
JasonPowell said on August 1, 2012
I didn’t realize that you are on the inside and know about all that is being worked through, my bad.
Mihai said on August 1, 2012
Here I was thinking that you are on the inside inspiring us with your wisdom about SAAB. It’s the internet, not everyone will agree with you.
ryanonsrc said on August 1, 2012
You’ve made your point Mihai: and we get it.
Please don’t decrease the signal-to-noise ratio of this thread by repeating it over and over.
Thanks
JasonPowell said on August 1, 2012
Mihai, I don’t recall ever saying at any point while writing here that I was on the inside other than that I run a Saab dealership. I don’t expect people to agree with my every word but when I make a comment and your response is to say that I am not in touch with reality, I have to question how that is backed up. I dare say that I do know more of what is going on than possibly you and to discredited my comments without clearly stating anything makes no sense. Read my initial comment again before you tell me or anyone else what is or isn’t reality.
Troels, Denmark said on August 2, 2012
+
Romac said on August 3, 2012
Hi @JasonPowell. You’re initial comment said: – is that what you meant to say? Just asking
JasonPowell said on August 3, 2012
Romac, its the same as saying they do nothing. To make sideline comments do no good at all. To say Saab is dead and we’re waiting for nothing does no good for anything, if that is truly the feeling, I don’t know why someone would be on this site.
Timeshifter said on August 2, 2012
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m81555zpYM1r4y150o2_500.png
The SAAB was dead since the day it stopped production without any plan how to get out of that situation.
There was literally no chance and no point in getting back to normal (lossy) production without an ENORMOUS backing budget. Within the bankrupt, the SAAB was given a new chance to live its live. The new owner could decide -
a) return to the production of the normal vehicles (which do not generate any profit) after more than a year of nothing being made, without any future
b) do something new and risky with a bigger potential to succeed.
If I would have to buy SAAB, I would do the same. There is no point to restarting the fight over market, which is 30 years after its horizon (peak) and it is so much saturated, that current gigantic corporations have problems to be profitable.
Instead, there is an area of vehicle design and manufacturing, which is expected to experience big boom in next 10-20 years. Yes, it is the electric automobile. Electric automobile fits perfectly to what has SAAB marque been known for.
So yes, SAAB is dead, but there is waiting a possible bright future for the marque. Or would you be happier, if for example Toyota or Valmet would buy the factory, burry the marque and all it’s heritage and build its own cars and machines in the factory? Because that is the only meaningful reason, why would one buy SAAB without any plan to do something different…
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Footnotes? This “big boom” IF it happens, will be led by giant corporations flush with money, not a consortium of investors who know nothing about producing cars. If you’re on the right path with this—-I think the batteries for the battery operated cars will be their focus, not the cars themselves—-least of all, Saabs. Also, to be clear, unless people have really long extension cords, there are no electric cars (except maybe trolley cars). These are rechargable battery operated cars. You use electric to recharge the batteries and the cars run on the batteries—-like my seven year old’s remote control buggies. Like toys in other words.
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
“Something Different” would be a manufacturer like Mahindra coming in and building smaller hatchbacks called Saab—-sort of like the cars Saab made and sold when they began—-and selling them at entry level prices. That’s “different” in that it hasn’t been done for a good many years. That would stand a far better chance at succeeding than golf carts bound for China.
Tilley said on August 1, 2012
I, for one, appreciate the level-headedness in your posts JasonPowell. Just thought I’d mention it.
JasonPowell said on August 1, 2012
thanks Tilley
Chris Hansel said on August 2, 2012
+2
Chris
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
Jason: I respect your point of view and I enjoy your writing—-sincerely—-but the fact is, it’s ridiculous that we DON’T know more about this deal. It’s crazy in fact. Around the world, this is NOT the way good, successful business is conducted. Professionals will tell you that in an aquisition like this, the best time to “win friends and influence people” is at the very, very early stages, right after the first announcement is made. That is when a real company will take the bull by the horns and steer the conversation in a positive direction—-talking about the glorious past that led them to WANT the factory and the name—–the troubling present that gave them the opportunity—-and the golden future that will make Saab stronger than ever—-appealing to more people, offering a wider product line, new technologies along with the tried and true that fans of the marque love—-people who understand public relations, relating to the freakin’ public! Making people WANT to wait for a new Saab/NEVS and being willing to buy a used Saab in the meantime—-after hearing there will be parts support and yes, maybe even some warranty support of some sort—-it’s called MAINTAINING CUSTOMERS and winning some new ones. In the first 15 days—-all of this should have been done, and repeated over and over—-making a splash in the news, getting free publicity around the world, in automotive publications, newspapers, business magazines and journals—-dealerships for crying out loud. Jason—-they don’t have a clue. That is really apparent if you try to look at this objectively. You are way too smart to be passive and act like this is normal and all is good. This is absolutely the wrong company to take Saab at the wrong time. If nothing else, I want to fight for the name Saab to be reserved for someone else as far as cars go. They don’t deserve the name for what they’ve talked about building and where they have talked about selling exclusively. This is a really bad time for us in the Saab community and we need to identify that, recognize it—-and have open discussions about it.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Well I’m waiting for the day when the doors to the factory open up again for employees to return… what everyone else is waiting for is his/her thing…
maanders said on August 1, 2012
I am waiting for a chance to see a picture of the 9-3 replacement (JC designed, based partly on the PhoeniX concept) that apparently all the bidders got to see. Even if NEVS is not going to go ahead and develop it or partner with someone to develop it, it would sill be a tragedy to never see it.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
In about 3-4 years we’ll know if it can be developed into a car, if it wont be and only with the permission of JC, I can publish some photos of the car… but until then, you’ll have to wait! =)
JH said on August 1, 2012
Isn’t the Jason Castriota designed (Phoenix based) 9-3 the car that NEVS plan to electrify after the Epsilon I based “current” 9-3?
Tim said on August 1, 2012
First the current 9-3, then a smaller car with a japanese platform and only IF they have money will they look at the JC 9-3. But I know that the JC 9-3 is big, about the same size as the old 9-5 so its a bit strange to make such a big car an electric car…
Markac said on August 2, 2012
Not Strange. The Tesla Model S is about the same size as an NG9-5. Still I was hoping J.C.’s design was only marginally bigger than the current 9-3. The NG9-5 probably got a little too big and the 9-3′s replacement shouldn’t follow that trend.
Timeshifter said on August 2, 2012
Tesla Model S is big because it is premium car. They make premium cars, because the technology and market is very young and they do not want to create hundreds of thousands vehicles per year. That is why they do smaller batches of premium vehicles. But one can expect that in few years the market will become more mature and with SAAB production potential there would be market gap of “middle sized” vehicles (aka 9-3) big enough for SAAB to relive new boom in its history. You should always think at least 3-8 years in the future.
Markac said on August 2, 2012
The model after the Model X electric SUV is said to be a smaller more affordable model. My point was that electric cars needn’t be small and isn’t Saab meant to be a premium brand too?
Timeshifter said on August 2, 2012
Mini is premium brand and it is small…
Tim said on August 2, 2012
We dont know what Saab is supposed to be. The Saab we saw before was a premium brand, but the car that will be born out of NEVS is still an unwritten card, nobody knows yet…
We might be looking at a whole new ballgame here…
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Tim: You make a good point and I’ll be honest: We DON’T know what will be born out of NEVS. Could be an affordable hybrid with the Saab name that would be perfect for me and many others. My anxiety about it at this point has gone from being product based to being availability based. No matter what they come out with—-if they only sell them in China or in a couple Eastern markets—-that does many, many of us no good at all. If they’re talking several years to make a car for China and say they MIGHT go elsewhere after that—-we’re looking about maybe 8 years at a minimum and suddenly, this really seems irrelavant. So much is going to happen to the industry in 8 years—–it’s like we have nothing to rally around at Saab with all of this uncertainty. “Wait and see” or “Be patient” or “Stay calm and carry on” all joking aside—-was acceptable for a few months—–now we’re over half a year. That’s not a long time in the grand scheme of things—-but it’s an eternity in trying to protect an corporate image. The process took too long to sort out—-and instead of improving the outlook by coming out of the gate fast—-NEVS is compounding the problem enormously by being so aloof. Do they not understand how it’s slipping away on them? Because it is.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Looking 3-8 years into the future is fine—-as long as you are hustling in the present. Standing on a diving board and thinking about your dive is fine—-but it becomes a huge problem when all you do is think about it and never go into the water.
Angelo V. said on August 5, 2012
Is Tesla making a profit and growing now? Have electric (battery operated) vehicles turned a profit for ANYONE, or are they bleeding millions all around, like the Chevy Volt is doing in the U.S.?
Mike Baughan said on August 2, 2012
<> Phoenix 9-3 Hybrid
liftarn said on August 2, 2012
Considering it was ready for prototype at the time of bankrupcy I think the NG9-3 can be put into production quite fast if there is a will.
Tim said on August 2, 2012
From what I’ve understood after talking to all parties of the development at the time of bankruptcy it was about 2 years away from full production, right now starting up a bunch of projects we could easily put another 1-2 years on top of that..
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
What bunch of projects?
jackfrost said on August 2, 2012
I hate to say this… but I also think this Saab is dead. This new company is just too mysterious, no press conference, nothing official about new Saab cars coming. Any information seems to be rumours no one really knows what these guys are up to lets be honest. I love Saabs but lets move on. A nice BMW 328xi is next on my list. It will be a 3 month wait but I know BMW will build it unlike Saabs which is wishful thinking. Time to move on folks and get over it..I some people won’t but c’est la vie!!
JasonPowell said on August 2, 2012
Hope you enjoy your 328, not the car I would want but to each their own.
Troels, Denmark said on August 2, 2012
++
Hans H said on August 2, 2012
+++
Tim said on August 2, 2012
I’ve heard from BMW dealers in Sweden, always talk to the mechanics, not the sales staff… There are brand new BMW’s rusting in the display hall at dealerships, Audi and VW engines breaking down after 120k km despite being maintained the way they are supposed to…
I wouldn’t count on the germans delivering quality in these days of crisis. Right now its all about making as much money as possible in order to survive for the next 3-5 years until the market picks up again…
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
That is a real concern—-and if it’s true, people that tend to hold onto their cars might want to shop for one with the longest warranty. Kia, Hyundai and Suzuki (in the U.S.) have much longer warranty coverage than the brands you mentioned. They can also cost less than half as much.
conrad said on August 28, 2012
Hope
You
Realize
Nothing is
Driveable
And
Inexpensive
conrad said on August 28, 2012
Hope
You
Understand
Nothing is
Driveable
And
Inexpensive
diane allison said on August 4, 2012
Yep you sure are waiting for nothing .What I’m told of parts November is the SOONEST .I hope that beautiful Saab holds out for everyone ..I wouldn’t hold my breath !!!
Rune said on August 4, 2012
In May I was informed that the part I’m waiting for would arrive in September. That part showed up a month ago.
Part supply has been lacking since early 2011, but it was only quite a bit into 2012 that Saab Parts said that work had started in earnest resolving that situation. I think it will be a bumpy ride for a few more months until all the is are dotted and ts crossed.
Christof Rytz said on August 1, 2012
I agree to Xon. Actualy I also do not see anything to wait for. Because NEVS seems not be able to close the deal there is maybe a small chance thar YM or so get back in the game.
SaabLife said on August 1, 2012
Actually it looks like YM is already moving on in their attempts to get into the European market.
“China Youngman Automobile Group Co. plans to acquire a 75% stake in Germany’s Viseon Bus GmbH for around €10 million, or roughly $12 million—the Chinese company’s latest attempt to expand internationally after failing to purchase Sweden’s Saab Automobile AB last year.” -Quoted from the WallStreet Journal.
MK said on August 1, 2012
With this purchase so for me right now it looks most like YM are just looking to enter the western market regardless of brand.
They are / were not interested in the Saab brand in itself, they want a factory outside China.
I might have wrong but this is my feelings right now.
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
They want to build cars and sell them in the west? That’s GREAT compared to selling golf carts in China only. I would take Youngman in a heartbeat over NEVS. I WANT a company who wants to sell cars in the west to have these Saab assets and the Saab name. Why wouldn’t every fan of Saab also want that? I also want a company who will sell cars with internal cumbustion engines and possibly hybrids—-not a company who plans to sell electric only and only in China. Let’s get real.
JH said on August 1, 2012
NEVS is not planning to sell cars only in China! They plan to start in China, but their market is global according to themselves. Do not spread misinformation.
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
That is good news if it is true. Did they happen to mention a timetable for going global? What is your source for this information that the will “start in China but have a global market.” Again—-when? 10 years? 20?
Tim said on August 1, 2012
All of that was stated during the press-conference when NEVS was announced to have the winning bid…
Please have a look at it again…
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
That press conference was a while back—-can you make this easy for me and instead of having me look it up—-tell me what model year they said that their products would be sold in North America?
JH said on August 5, 2012
Model year? How are the even supposed to know that themselves? They haven’t even gotten access to the property in Trollhättan yet!
Markac said on August 2, 2012
Angelo may have over simplified things, but NEVS has actually stated that it’s main focus will be China as it believes other countries will, (at least initially) lack the infrastructure required for electric vehicles.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
Yes, I’m guilty of oversimplifying things, but have you seen NEVS website? Holy cow, they are saying NOTHING. Since this purchase was announced, “simple” doesn’t even begin to describe how little we’ve heard about their plans.
Markac said on August 3, 2012
I’m fairly suspicious of NEVS. I think that what we have seen of it’s business plan (It’s not giving away much) is highly speculative and relies on market conditions that currently don’t exist, and probably won’t in it’s given time frame. I won’t slam it totally yet, but neither will I look at it through rose coloured glasses like some. In fact I think we all need to be a bit more balanced and objective here. Wishful thinking is fine, but it doesn’t achieve much in the cold light of day. When the NEVS deal is complete, there are a number of probing questions that need to be asked. As to whether we get any answers, that’s likely quite doubtful. All we can do is try I guess?
Anyway I have a growing feeling that NEVS is not actually about making cars at all even though it might try to give that illusion. So not having access to the Saab brand name won’t bother it too much in the long term.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
I think you’re right. Another tidbit that gives it away is that we’re hearing there is no disposition on the Saab name. If NEVS plan was to sell cars around the world—-I think that “detail” would have been nailed down before the decision of who was buying Saab out of bankruptcy was announced. If they are passive on the name, it tells me they are passive about building cars—-at least building them and selling them around the world. Their eyes are on something other than car manufacturing. Batteries?
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Lets see if they can come up with the money for that one?… sorry but to plan and to do are two very different things…
SaabLife said on August 2, 2012
And what happens if they do produce the money?
JasonPowell said on August 4, 2012
I guess if they produce the money they own the company? If they produce the money I think you may need to investigate further as to where it came from and how the deal was completed before you say “see, I told you”
Allan B said on August 1, 2012
This is good news. Better that the deal is completed properly and in good order than done badly or not at all. Funny how people who claim to have turned their back on Saab still turn up here to post comments.
ryanonsrc said on August 1, 2012
+1
Saab cannot be rebuilt over-night. And while this drama has been going on for a long, long time. The clock that we are actually interested in didn’t start until the middle of June (when the NEVS purchase of Saab was first announced). That means we are just over a month into the purchase of Saab … any predictions at this point would be grossly premature.
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
Rome was built more quickly than this deal will take. I had already posted on another thread here about this. I had heard it was a lack of funding/money on NEVS part. I’m praying that the door might crack open just enough for Mahindra or Youngman to rush in again. I know it’s unlikely, but we can dream. NEVS will not give people who love Saab what we are looking for. For that matter, Mahindra and Youngman won’t please everyone either—-but I do firmly believe Mahindra and Youngman can keep more current Saab customers and find more new ones—-than NEVS will ever be capable of. Frankly, I’m insulted by NEVS lack of public comments regarding this aquisition. It really is insulting to people who love Saab—-and those who don’t feel insulted are so desparate for the brand to survive, they are taking this afront and smiling about it. Facing reality is hard.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Well what you’ve heard is not relevant because who ever is spreading rumors has no inside knowledge anyway. I hear a lot of stuff all the time, guess what, 99% turns out to be lies so until there is an official statement then we can discuss if NEVS has any money or not…
And if Rome was built faster, that is clearly a bad thing since Rome fell due to having a corrupt foundation and was clearly not built correctly from the start, so clearly going fast is not the way to do things
I’m gonna tell you something now and I want you to listen clearly, YM did not have the money needed which is why they were not allowed to buy Saab. Simple… so forget YM ever existed as an option because they never were one! I know this for a fact, I got copies of very important documents regarding this matter, do you?… Facing reality is hard…
Baver said on August 1, 2012
Did we ever hear from Mahindra? Do we know that they presented a bid for Saab?
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Yes they did, but from what I’ve heard not for the complete thing and they were not prepared to put up the money required to restore the brand…
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
From what you HEARD, Mahindra “…were not prepared to put up the money required to restore the brand…” Tim—-that sounds very subjective, versus the very OBJECTIVE proclamation you made that YM didn’t have the money needed which is why they were not allowed to buy Saab. You say you have copies of very important documents regarding the matter. Do those documents PROVE the assertion that Youngman didn’t have the money or couldn’t get it? If so, are you allowed to share them with the public? If not, they (excuse the pun) aren’t worth the paper they’re written on. If these documents are proof positive that Youngman didn’t have enough money to back their bid—-the Receivers should be very outspoken about it. Why the cloak of secrecy? Back to Mahindra, what does “restoring the brand” mean? For crying out loud, how is ANYTHING we’ve heard from NEVS even remotely connected to restoring the Saab brand? Holy cow, they are off on a silly path that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the Saab brand or restoring it in any way that most people who like Saab want anything to do with. To say Mahindra “doesn’t have the money to restore the Saab brand” is a falsehood. To say “NEVS doesn’t have the ideas to restore the Saab brand” is 100% true from the information we have to work with at this point.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Well lets just say that I’ve heard the things about Mahindra from very reliable sources and I’ll leave it at that. But I’ve also heard that they are still not 100% out, things are happening in the background, but it as always a matter of judging if the information provided to us is reliable or not which is a very difficult thing to do… I’d like to believe that Mahindra is still in the game but I’m of course a bit influenced because I know what it would mean for the people in Trollhättan if they do are involved.
I’m not willing to discuss in detail what those documents contain other than that they convince me that YM never had the money to do what they said that they would do and that they didn’t have the money to buy Saab from the bankruptcy-administrators. And NO, I will never share information like that with the public. I’ve got a lot more that I will not share either, it is privileged information for the SU-Crew only! We will NEVER EVER reveal anything entrusted to us by our sources. If we did that just once, then nobody will ever trust us with important information again and we’d might as well close down this site… Steven had the exact same attitude which earned him a lot of respect among people in high places, we also gained that respect by acting the same way!
The receivers do not discuss matters of business because they signed agreements with all the parties, including Mahindra and YM not to discuss the process, which is the way it is normally done. Nothing strange there… it they would have talked they would have lost their jobs, perhaps even ended up in prison…
Nothing we’ve heard about NEWS is connected into restoring the Saab brand. NEVS are about restarting the factory again… making sure the competence of those great people who used to work there is put to good use so that NEVS can make money, thats what its all about…
Mahindra might have the money to buy all of Europe, but thats not the point, the point is are they willing to risk that money or not…
SpinM said on August 1, 2012
Angelo, please. All of us, who care for Saab and the continuation of the great tradition of excellent Swedish cars made in Trollhattan feel frustrated to some point about all that has happened and this endless silence by NEVS. I will agree with you, that NEVS is right now very much loosing the momentum it should have seized, especially in public relations, but Tim and other valiant writters of this site should not be used for chanelling your anger. Faced with reality which they can’t change, they chose to stay optimistic. I too, despite all, am still hoping for something good to come out of this. In 6 – 8 years, when I expect to replace my now fairly new Saab, perhaps there just might be a chance to get another new Saab. If not, well then I guess, I’ll just have to buy something else. Either way, it will not be Tim’s fault.
JasonPowell said on August 2, 2012
Your right, it won’t be Tim’s fault…. It will be Angelo’s. Kidding of coarse, sometimes we need to bring humor into these comments. All kidding aside, we need to remember what Saab means to us. If Saab were to be gone forever, would you like it less? I wouldn’t, I am a fan of the car, the drive and the people. That being said, I do want to see a Saab revival and see the beautiful Saabs rolling down production lines again. I will remain optimistic and talk about the good points of the Saab I know because that is what I like to do and if that were to change, I don’t think it would be right for me to right on a site called SAABSUNITED because if being united meant that I was throwing out negative this and that, that is not the kind of united that I am in to.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
I’m not angry at the site administrators—-but I am perhaps having a difference of opinion with them over the process that put this factory and the assets in the hands of NEVS. Simply stated: I refuse to be a Pollyanna in this case. Too much is at stake. I’m amazed that people who loved the old Saab ARE being Pollyannas to some extent. That anger is directed at the situation, not at individuals on this website. It’s times like these when people have to take a stand and over time, we’ll see how it all plays out. My guess is that we’ll be writing about “what could have been.” I actually hope I am dead wrong—-I hope NEVS surprises us all—-that they bring cars to market sooner than I’m expecting. That they sell the cars in many parts of the world where Saabs have been sold in the past. That the cars are offered with gas/diesel engines, hybrids and that electrics are not the only thing they offer. That the cars are priced within reach of traditional Saab buyers if not even more people with an entry level model. If they can hit on those cylinders, I’ll be wrong about this whole thing and I’ll be a very happy camper. If a few years from now, there are no NEVS rolling off the assembly line—-or a few, all headed for China and no discussion about exporting to North America. All electric, overpriced, short range—–it’ll be disgraceful. At that point, I’ll be hoping for a NEVS bankruptcy and fire sale to a car maker who can swoop in and buy for pennies on the dollar.
JasonPowell said on August 3, 2012
Angelo, I don’t know anything about you or your age but you keep using the word pollyanna and at 38, I have never heard that word used before. I looked it up and by definition I don’t understand your use of it. I have constantly said in the past and today that we need to wait and see or better yet give them a chance. So by definition, how are any of us being pollyanna’s (unreasonably or illogically optimistic)? I am optimistic but I don’t think it is unreasonably or illogical. Time will tell and as always, it is much easier to just sit back and say oh nope, they are lying and have no plans for this or that yet none of that has been said from anyone at NEVS or the admin so wouldn’t that make you the exact opposite of a pollyanna and just negative. I’m not trying to be an ass here, just seems that if we are pollyanna’s then what are you? I think you like Saabs, I really do, but I don’t think you are even open to seeing anything to do with NEVS as being good and I don’t know if that would even change if they made a car.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Yes, you have the definition right: Pol·ly·an·na /ˌpɒliˈænə/ Show Spelled[pol-ee-an-uh] Show IPA
noun
1. an excessively or blindly optimistic person.
And I think the “realists” are looking into the situation with an open mind—-and seeing NEVS staggering around—-seeing NEVS joke of a website—-reading between the lines with the LACK of information/lack of vision/lack of optimism being expressed by NEVS THEMSELVES FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! The silence is deafening. Many of us (me included) are being NEGATIVE about NEVS because we’ve seen other mergers and aquistions—-we’ve seen companies emerge from bankruptcies—-and what we’re seeing and hearing now (more specifically, what where NOT seeing and NOT hearing) can only be interpreted as negative and many of us have supported that position logically (read the comments on this thread alone). So I think to have a “wait and see” attitude, particularly if it’s spiced up with “electric cars are the future—–NEVS is right to not try to compete in today’s world, they have to look to tomorrow” or, “China is a big car market and they want to mandate electric cars—-so NEVS needs to begin there but then they’ll build cars for export to other countries”—-or, “they must have a partner who will build gas engined cars while they work on EV technology” I can go on with more—-but the point is, this sort of rosy speculation, in my mind, is overly optimistic—-it gives NEVS the benefit of the doubt at every turn. Some are so concerned with that factory running again—-NEVS could say they are building tanks that convert to helicopters and run on coconut juice—and they are going to sell them in the Congo—-and these peole would find a spin to say how NEVS is “way ahead of the curve.” THAT is being a pollyanna. As far as the age/use of that word goes—-the word “hot” to describe attractive women, was a 1940s term that went out of style. So when it came back in the 1980s, the first people using it were told “you sound like my grandfather—-who calls women “hot” anymore? Of course here we are 30 years later, and many are STILL using the term. I’m bringing “Pollyanna” back. It’s so perfect in this situation. Spread it around. Let’s make “Pollyanna” famous again.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
“I think you like Saabs, I really do, but I don’t think you are even open to seeing anything to do with NEVS as being good and I don’t know if that would even change if they made a car.” It would depend on the car. Right now, I just want to hear what any good and loyal customer of a company would want to hear: What the heck are their plans? What do I have to look forward to? They’re mum at this point. Why?
Either they have no plan or they know the plan they have won’t sit well with Saab owners. THAT is what I conclude. What do you conclude? “They are being silent because that’s how good businesses are run?”
Niklas G said on August 2, 2012
+1
Good summary of the situation, Allan B!
RemcoH said on August 1, 2012
I partially agree. Yes, Saab is dead. Untill proven otherwise.
All I can do is wait and see (and hope!) at what the outcome of the NEVS deal will be.
And at the same time, I will find myself a nice MY2008 aero convertible to make the waiting time as pleasant as it can be.
With an almost new car I buy myself some time and hope for the best.
For the coming period I will not by another brand, because I simpy don’t have to.
JasonPowell said on August 1, 2012
Fully agree with you. If you have a car that is suiting you fine now, why do anything? The only people I see that have a problem right now or in the not so distant future are people with company lease cars. If you don’t have to switch or get a new car, don’t. If you still love Saab though and want a new car, there was nothing wrong with the 2011 models that can still be found.
Kyle Hudson said on August 1, 2012
Agree to you on that Jason! I recently just bought a 1993 900 S 5 speed and soon will acquire a 1998 900 SE Turbo 5 speed. If you currently own a saab, and have no intentions of getting rid of said saab, why bother being so negative? you have nothing to worry about, for there will ALWAYS be a saab out there in this automotive sea.
EuroDriver said on August 2, 2012
Maybe if you know the answer you can explain this one question I have. Whom do the lessees pay their monthly car payments to now that Saab is in hibernation mode?
JasonPowell said on August 2, 2012
Payments are made to Ally in North America
Tim said on August 2, 2012
Which in other words is a nice name for GM…?
JasonPowell said on August 2, 2012
Not really Tim, GM had to sell most of their stake in Ally and have recently been starting a new finance company. Not sure what GM’s stake in Ally is not but it is not a controlling stake.
Rune said on August 2, 2012
FWIW: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ally_Financial — US government holds 73.7% of the shares. GM owns 4%.
Angelo V. said on August 5, 2012
Why is my government owning this? What is going on?
E said on August 1, 2012
+1
JH said on August 1, 2012
I don’t understand all the negativity from many commenters here… Deals like this are extremely complex and takes time, get real please! NEVS will have to start almost from scratch anyway, so one more month isn’t a deal breaker and it might even be good if it means that they have time to sort out all the details.
The thing I see as most important is that the Trollhättan factory gets to produce cars again, in some volumes, for the sake of the people in the city. They’ve recently lost their biggest private employer! If the cars are called Saab, not only pure electric and appeal to me it’s great, but I can’t count on it. In fact, that has not been certain since April 2011 I’d say… And no, I don’t live in Trollhättan so I am not “biased” on this matter.
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
JH: You forgot to add that maybe it would be appealing if they sell their cars not only in China, but in other countries where people like Saab. That’s missing in their business plan too apparently. They are amateurs. This isn’t going well at all. I for one hope that something causes this deal to come to a screaching halt—-frankly, I don’t even care what circumstance that might be—-I just want NEVS out of this already. I know that probably isn’t going to happen, but if it does—-and if we can get Youngman or Mahindra interested in this again, there might be a tiny glimmer of hope for people who love Saab—-that Saab in some reasonable form will be back.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
Perhaps it’s missing because it is supposed to be missing. Do you have any clue to how much money is needed in order to restart Saab to what it used to be and who would be willing to risk that kind of money. I’ll give you the answer: NOBODY!
Mahindra and YM were after technology, they were not after restoring Saab to what we once thought was its glorious days.
Angelo: What you want is completely irrelevant, I find it absolutely amazing that you still haven’t understood that! What matters is that the employees get their jobs back and that something is produced in that factory so that the company again can make money and start a long and slow recovery and perhaps one day be able to build something great for us to buy. If that product happens to be rubber-dog-shit or electric cars doesn’t matter…
What matters is that people have jobs and that the company makes money which Saab has only done for two years out of its 60 year history…
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
Tim: If it’s true that Saab only made money two years and either broke even or lost money the other 58 years (you didn’t say), I find that amazing. How did they stay in business? Was it hand-outs from the Swedish government or was it money from related businesses going to offset the losses at Saab cars? In any event, if the only thing that matters is people having jobs and the company making money—-why not turn it into a factory that produces LEGO toys (They are selling quite well) or maybe a tire factory—-or balloons—-over the counter pain relievers—-Justin Bieber posters—-furniture—-light bulbs—small sailboats—go-karts for amusement parks—tuna fish and sardines cannery—-because with NEVS, the things we’ve heard about have less to do with Saab cars than some of the things I mentioned and frankly, less chance to succeed. Find something marketable and convert the factory if this is simply about providing jobs for the future. NEVS will gobble up money like Ms. Pac Man gobbles up pellets—–and leave the place a shambles in a few years anyway.
JH said on August 1, 2012
Interesting that you have a crystal ball! Can you also tell us which side will win the Swedish election in 2014?
Seriously, you feel insulted by NEVS’ lack of communication? What are they supposed to say? I think it’s sound that they don’t say a lot about about their plans before they have even acquired anything from the bankruptcy estate. And I don’t buy your accusations of them lacking appropriate funding. Don’t you think the bankruptcy administrators looked into this before choosing them? Would NEVS have bought 49 hectares of land with a lot of buildings from Hemfosa if they hadn’t the money? Reliable sources claim that Kai Johan Jiang is a good businessman and I don’t think he would risk his money and reputation on something that wasn’t carefully thought through.
JH said on August 1, 2012
Oh, and for many many years when Saab Automobile was part of Saab-Scania, the very profitable Scania truck division covered for a lot of losses from the car division. I’m not saying Saab Automobile has always been losing money, because that isn’t true, but it most certainly never was a profit machine.
EuroDriver said on August 2, 2012
How can we be sure NEVS isn’t after the tech either? I don’t like the schism going on between Saab owners/enthusiasts.
JH said on August 2, 2012
If NEVS were only after the technology, why would they have bought 49 hectares of land with a lot of buildings, including the Saab factory, in Trollhättan?
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Aren’t they a venture capital group? Real estate might be a very wise investment, especially if you’re leveraged up to your eyeballs and can re-sell at a profit.
RS said on August 2, 2012
“What matters is that the employees get their jobs back and that something is produced in that factory so that the company again can make money and start a long and slow recovery and perhaps one day be able to build something great for us to buy. If that product happens to be rubber-dog-shit or electric cars doesn’t matter…”
Tim, with all due respect. To 99.9 % of the Saab customers this is totally untrue. It’s not about jobs in THN but making vehicles we can buy. If former Saab employees want ANY kind of work they are free to apply for the factories making rubber-s***. Maybe some Chinese company can be lured to the area? I can already see the headlines.
Tim said on August 2, 2012
Well then me and 99.9% of the Saab customers disagree on something…
I think that 99.9% of Saab customers buy the car because it is made in Scandinavia, it has something unique and Sweden represents production quality. So yes, I do think most Saab people agree with me that it matters who and where the cars are built and designed…
scand said on August 2, 2012
Swedish design is one thing, manufacturing it in Sweden less so, especially, the further away you physically are from Sweden/trollhattan.
Take ikea for example. People like it enough to buy it because it’s Swedish design (they buy it because its cheap). If it was actually made in Sweden, it wouldn’t sell, it would be too expensive.
Is a Mercedes made in Alabama any less of a Mercedes than a German one, a VW or Audi from Hungary ( or Mexico) less than one from Germany?
If the only way the Saab brand survived was to move the manufacturing to a lower cost country, to me that would be preferable to it it dying completely, or metamorphosing into electric who knows what, and called who knows what.
My guess is that the existing dealers, such as they are, would prefer that, if it gave some sort of continuity rather than a dead end.
I can completely understand you wanting at all
costs to have the factory reopening and making *something*, given your personal connections with it though.
RS said on August 2, 2012
Please don’t mix the two. 99.9 % of Saab fans don’t care who the former employees work for if not building cars -which they aren’t. You mentioned stuff I have no interest in or won’t buy just because it’s made at a certain geographic location.
With NEVS primary target in China how Scandinavian are the vehicles really going to be? They won’t even mention the use of IC engines as power generators which will be a critical offering for at least the next 15 years.
There is nothing I hate more in a car than electrical or charging problems. With EV’s you’re facing that practically every day thinking how fast or for how long can I drive before running out of juice when the car plugged in for x number of hours. It would be nerve wrecking as hell for those who travel hundreds or thousands of miles every week to the point a car like that is out of the question. A hybrid on the other hand never stops.
Tim, don’t get me wrong your time at the helm of SU has been the most difficult in Saabs history and you’ve done very very well but now only looking after the employment of the former workforce is very short sighted IMHO. This is a community about Saab cars, not about new job opportunities in a town in western Sweden, again IF NOT designing and engineering those cars we love for a reason.
xelav said on August 3, 2012
RS : you took the words right out of my mouth.
Baver said on August 2, 2012
TimR, I agree about being made in Scandinavia. I was ready to plop down a rather large sum of money for the new 9-4x and then I saw where it was made. I was shocked. To me, that is not a true Saab. Over the years, I have gone out of my way to buy Swedish. I had a Swedish washer and dryer and am on my second Swedish dishwasher (ASKO -sadly closing up their factory outside Trollhättan and moving it to Slovenia), have a Swedish made clock of all things (current ones made in China), a Swedish made air cleaner(also now made in China), and now my third, new Swedish made Saab. I also had a Volvo, but we won’t talk about that. There’s something special about “Made in Sweden”, but I also am aware that with current costs of labor and exchange rates, people will need to pay a premium for these items and sadly, that doesn’t seem to be happening. Production is moving to lower cost areas and people need to take a stand for future production jobs in these higher cost areas. Once they’re gone, and they are going rapidly, they won’t return until our standard of living has declined dramatically. We’re all being used. The Germans seem to have taken over, and for them, it doesn’t seem to matter if it’s made in Germany, South Africa, or South Carolina.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
I see both sides. Volkswagens made in Mexico don’t seem as German to me for example. But we’re now being hit with a reality stick. Cars made in the USA include Toyota, Nissan, Honda, BMW, Mercedes—-cars made in Canada and Mexico include General Motors and Ford. Realistically, things are changing and whether we like it or not, a lot of this has to do with survivial—-being able to sell cars at a price people are willing to pay or can afford. I think I will consider a true Saab to be one that is primarily designed and engineered in Sweden, by Swedes. If they want to assemble it in India or China—-or the U.S.—-I still will consider it a Saab and will be more likely to buy if the price is more affordable.
scand said on August 3, 2012
Not forgetting that quite a percentage of the manufacture of any European car is in all likelihood done by a (German) Kuka robot, and not a human being!
Tim said on August 1, 2012
I bet all the negative people go to work and the first thing they ask their colleagues are: “What shall we complain about today?” before they even say good morning =P
Angelo V. said on August 1, 2012
I bring a very positive attitude to work—-my colleagues and I challenge each other to push ourselves to the limit to provide the very best outcome for our business partners and clients. We do a great job. I am very thankful to have a job in these times, so I completely understand the desire to put factory workers back to work in Sweden. I want someone to take over that factory—-who will be there for the long haul. A company with a vision for successfully building and selling Saab cars all over the world again. I’m not seeing that in the scenario that is playing out and it’s maddening.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
I agree with you, but if they dont sell Saab cars I will settle for the next best thing… which is what ever floats the boat…
Even if they start making toilets it will be the best toilets in the world and I’ll buy one!
theSandySaab said on August 2, 2012
Toilets?
Well, maybe I’ll get one if it has four wheels and is turbo charged (mechanically or biologically, bean powered)!
;-P
3cyl said on August 2, 2012
That is not a vehile I would want to be driving behind.
Tim said on August 2, 2012
Bio”Power”
dezzer said on August 2, 2012
i will be in washington in a couple of weeks so will thrash this out over a pint or two !!!
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
I’d probably have a 7 year old in tow, but I’m game for that dezzer. He likes Hooters—-but name your choice. We’re not far from Tysons Corner, the DC suburb.
dezzer said on August 3, 2012
is that a rough area ????? do i need to bring my baton and cs spray ?
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Parts of Washington, DC are rough. But Tysons Corner is far from rough! It’s a cushy suburb you know! And the Hooters girls at the Fairfax location are very nice ladies!
JH said on August 1, 2012
Exactly!
maanders said on August 1, 2012
From reading here over the last couple of years, that sounds more like Swedish media.
Tim said on August 1, 2012
hehe, well it probably applies to them as well =P
StefanH STHLM (www.bmsg.se/saab sales.pdf) said on August 1, 2012
Deadline isnt the word to use in this article. Thats a distranslation. A Deadline is very definit this, when this is not.
Theyve Planned to finish the deal now but due to different issues the have to postpone that date. Thats all.
saaburban said on August 1, 2012
Saab survived for more tan 60 years not by making profits, but by making customers and employees believe that the next product would be truly amazing.
NEVS has to sell some vision, a teaser or a Scandinavian dream, so that people will start to believe. This is essential for hiring the most inspiring minds, and attracting the Saab customers.
If NEV Sweden would make a affordable teardrop shape Saab with the simplicity of the ursaab, yet the comfort and power of a new griffin, I would be a believer!
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
If NEVS would tell us what, when, where and possibly how—-we could leave out the who and the why and I could get behind them. When and where is critical at this point, and the cat’s got their tongue. If they could build the car you described—-they’d win me over, provided it also had a cruisng range of at least 300 miles and a gas back-up so the car could be taken on long trips without fear of not having an electrical outlet available to continue the journey.
Tim said on August 2, 2012
It is amazing, but sadly its true… Money was being thrown around carelessly and I’m hearing these stories all the time about money being wasted. No wonder GM was pissed off at the Saab guys.
Flying reporters up to mountaintops in the alps with a helicopter for days in order for them to try the Turbo X? Why couldn’t that have been done in Sweden where we have fantastic roads that’ll do the job just as well only a few km from Trollhättan…
Allan B said on August 2, 2012
That snippet is interesting Tim. What a stupid waste of money given Saab’s finances at the time, especially considering Sweden has such a great landscape within its own borders.
terry9000k said on August 2, 2012
VM, via Spyker had quite a handful if I remember correctly.
JH said on August 5, 2012
VM of course got quite a bit of money (salary etc.) for his work at Saab, but one must take his own investments into account. All in all, he lost 13 million Euro on Saab according to himself in Swedish TV4′s documentary “Saabs sista strid” (“Saab’s last fight”).
davidgmills said on August 2, 2012
Show me me the money. Saab’s biggest problem. When was the money due this last time?
dezzer said on August 2, 2012
me thinks that Saab should have been sold on ebay !!!
Mike Baughan said on August 2, 2012
What’s that old line… expect the best but prepare for the worst..?
I guess what I’m saying is that I sincerely hope NEVS is successful but I recognize that they have a big job of not only making desirable vehicles and a sustainable business, but they have the big task of winning over the hearts and minds of people who wrote Saab off a long time ago and an even larger job of winning over the hearts and minds of people who are writing Saab off right now.
Only time will tell, but I’m crossing my fingers hoping that NEVS pulls a rabbit (a hybrid, Phoenix-shaped rabbit) out of its hat.
TonymacUK said on August 2, 2012
Sorry Tim,but this latest news only deepens my suspicions about NEVS.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
I don’t want to sound condesending or insulting—-but the truth is, if one views this objectively, without rose colored glasses—suspicions can only deepen the more we learn. I keep hoping like a bear coming out of hiberation—-NEVS will suddenly start talking in terms that will make us more optimistic. Absent that—-what else is there than suspicions? To be optimistic based on what we’ve heard, you need a wild imagination.
aus715 said on August 2, 2012
Drive your car. Enjoy it. Savour it. Enjoy the turbo power and timeless looks.
And wait.
TonymacUK said on August 2, 2012
I`m doing that, but it doesn`t change my opinion about NEVS
Angelo V. said on August 5, 2012
+1 It’s actually just pissing me off all the more when I enjoy my car so much (including the turbo power AUS mentioned) and when I ponder the fact that NEVS will abandon THAT Saab for this “bold, new, battery operated cars for China” Saab. That hurts.
LarsG said on August 2, 2012
People who are forced to buy a new car – of course buy whatever you want. We other who can wait and see – let´s do so. Now it´s the time when we see who are the real Saab fan and who are not.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
Does anyone even have the rights to use the Saab name on cars at this point? I thought the name “Saab” didn’t sell with the bankruptcy assets. Lars, right now, I would assume that the only thing “real Saab fans” could buy is an airplane to get around in, or a used car…or a “new” one with no factory warranty. “Real Saab fans” no longer have a “real Saab cars” to be a fan of.
LarsG said on August 2, 2012
Well Angelo, I have two real Saab cars to be a fan of and I will continue to take care of them irrespective of it will be produced Saab cars in the future or not.
diane allison said on August 3, 2012
Ya well we’ll see how you feel when your car breaks down and you can’t find parts .
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Lars: Latest parts squabbling I saw is that someone was told “end of August” (that’s about a month) for a brake light bulb. Are they kidding? I sure hope things get better, not worse, as time goes by. I want to keep my ’04 at least another few years. Frankly, for the low mileage I put on and the excellent maintenance on that car (and it’s prime condition) I would like to have it until around 2020. That probably won’t happen if getting parts becomes a nightmare. Good news for me is that I have other cars—-so I guess I could wait a month or two for a simple little part. Others aren’t that fortunate.
3cyl said on August 2, 2012
Angelo’s post near the start of this discussion addressed the lack of information from NEVs. As real SAAB fans, we may be willing to have a wait and see attitude, but Angelo’s point that NEVs has not communicated in a manner designed to to maintain our enthusiasm is valid.
Quixcube said on August 2, 2012
People who are forced to buy a new car now are, sadly, also being forced to enjoy things like adaptive cruise control, pedestrian alert and avoidance systems, blind spot detection, navigation with real-time traffic alerts and maps maintained and updated by Google, personalized streaming internet radio, weather reports and increasingly better fuel economy with light- and full-hybrid drivetrains. Poor fools.
Even if they buy a new car now and then trade it in on a new Saab later (if there ever are any more), I suppose they will have lost their “real Saab fan” status forever. Haven’t studies have shown that an abstinence-only policy doesn’t really work?
JerseySaab said on August 3, 2012
I frankly would not want any of those things on a car. My 9000 already has more gadgetry than I like.
Quixcube said on August 3, 2012
Let’s agree to disagree. This isn’t a jab. I enjoy reading your responses. You strike me as someone who intensely appreciates classic Saabs and probably for very good reasons. That’s fortunate and I am envious of your ability to continue enjoying a snapshot of time when exceptionally well-machined gear and genuinely superior engineering were everywhere in a Saab. The classic models really were a cut above. It’s great for me to see a 900 or a 9000, but it’s only a fleeting feeling. I see flashbacks to great times but I can’t drive a classic daily.
I’m hooked on technology. I want the high-end thinking that went into classic Saabs paired with the constant refinements that data processing and reactive systems can bring to the experience. Carburetors gave way to fuel injection. Fuel injection constantly improved as sensors, materials and processors improved and now hybrid-drive systems emerge that combine multiple energy sources in real-time reacting to data from thousands of sensors in ways that make engineers grin. It’s true too for transmissions, and brakes and suspensions. Radios gave way to digital music players that give way to digital uplinks to networks that provide access to all sorts of situational information (much more than entertainment) for drivers. Cars are becoming aware of where they are and what is around them and they can react to that. I find that thrilling.
So –>to LarsG<– I can't sit on the sidelines for long, but I do remember and respect Saab for what they were and what they could be again. I am a Saab fan but I don't hold my breath. But I do bring Saab up in stories and conversations as an example of smart thinking and committed people trying to build something recognizably better than the rest (except for those slightly dark times when another company tried to smother all that good thinking).
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Wow—-when I read your original entry, I was in a rush and I actually thought you were being sarcastic—-in a way that was PANNING those “advancements.” As I read through the list again, I see that what you meant is that people are buying improved cars with all of these new technologies. Honestly, I think a lot of it is overkill that raises the prices of new cars out of the reach of some people—-end up needing costly repairs—-malfunction even after the failed “reprogramming”—–can be real nightmares. Pedestrian alert and avoidance? Like Airbags caused people to stop wearing seatbelts, I think a lot of things like this will make drivers lazier and in turn—-will breed less capable drivers. Expensive garbage in some cases. BMW had “weather alert” radios on cars in the early ’90s. Many radio stations play weather every 15 minutes or so. I don’t need a “weather alert by computer” junking up my car.
JerseySaab said on August 3, 2012
I’m definitely not hooked on technology. Having worked in the computer industry for decades, much of that time in software development, I know full well the inherent problems of being on the bleeding edge. I do not want a lot of complex computerized gadgetry in a car that is going to malfunction, cause problems, and cost huge amounts of money to repair — at a shop of course because the systems are too complex for the home mechanic to deal with. Thousands of sensors? Cars “aware” of where they are and taking control from the driver? Yikes! Thanks but no thanks.
Granted, I’m probably in the minority being happy driving a well-engineered but more basic car equipped with a radio and tape deck, using spot mirrors at $1.00US each for “blind spot detection.” Guess I should keep an eye out for a nice, clean 9000 to keep around as a spare for when my current one (with near 300,000 miles on the odometer) finally decides to give up.
Though I would not turn my nose up at the more basic later models either.
Christian said on August 2, 2012
Besides all negative or positive comments as to be read above, what makes me sad is the outlook towards not being able to buy a new Saab when I need to replace my current 9-3. Due to cost and the risk of increased maintenance, I will habe to think about either keeping mine or getting a new one in about one year. (I don’t buy pre-owned cars, generally.) thus, articles like the one above just make me sad. Very sad. And I do have to agree to some of the comments by Angelo V. and others asking what NEVS does at the moment to keep customers like me in a better mood (if not even this community can do much about it).
alwaysSaab said on August 2, 2012
What happened to the discussion on NEVS’ use of the brand name “Saab”? I supposed no conclusion as well? There is absolutely no news from the Administrators. Are there still there or they have received their fat fee, considered the job done and have since left?
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
I have a feeling the Adinistrators are finding a way to get free lunches. The Saab name? We can only hope that it will stay in mothballs until someone more deserving steps up to obtain it.
terry9000k said on August 2, 2012
.
I find it strange NEVs have been given the keys to the door & yet they have still not finalized the deal/contracts.
I Hope the Administrators’ & Hemfosa’s have seen the colour of their money…
Otherwise it’s Déjà vu
JH said on August 5, 2012
I’m pretty sure the haven’t gotten access to the property in Trollhättan yet…
Allan B said on August 2, 2012
Tim is right, the negative people will find something to moan and bitch about no matter what. Whenever I need to be reminded of the potentially great future ahead, I just take another look at NEVS’s website. The fact that it is humble and understated gives me confidence that these guys are not just all talk and no trousers. They are waiting until they get the foundations in place first. You can see it there stated plainly what they intend to do – make electric cars in Trollhättan, focusing initially on China. Until the deal is concluded, it is irrational (and could be evidence of a mildly psychotic egotism) to insist that NEVS should be making further public announcements about what they are doing next. They are in the driving seat, not us. So until the deal is signed and they are ready to announce what they are doing next, we just have to put up or shut up. To paraphrase Timeshifter, the option of continuing to make traditional cars at a loss doesn’t work. So to paraphrase Captain Kirk, better to boldly go where no-one has gone before. And until NEVS market cars in Europe, I will Klingon to my current Saab for as long as is necessary.
Markac said on August 2, 2012
Actually Captain Kirk said “to boldly go where no ‘man’ has gone before”. It was Captain Jean-Luc Picard who said “to boldly go where ‘no-one’ has gone before”, in a different era. Perhaps NEVS will need Kirk and Sulu too to help it navigate Chinese import tariffs?
Allan B said on August 2, 2012
And perhaps Spock to come up with a battery with a 500-mile range. I thought Kirk said ‘no man’ in the TV series and later ‘no-one’ in the films. Oh well, every day is a school day.
davidgmills said on August 2, 2012
You forgot the five minute recharge
Markac said on August 3, 2012
You’re right Kirk said ‘no-one’ in the films that were made after “Star Trek: The Next Generation” series had arrived, so I guess Picard said it first? As to the 500 mile battery, I don’t think it’s too far away. Someone down here in Oz managed to go over 500 kilometres in a Tesla Roadster and it wasn’t Leonard Nimoy!
Allan B said on August 3, 2012
Leonard Nimoy as Hamlet:
“To be, or not to be …
… is illogical Captain.”
Tim said on August 2, 2012
Respect!
jond said on August 2, 2012
Actually, either one is a split infinitive. Correct English, I believe, should be ‘boldly to go’.
Allan B said on August 2, 2012
No, correct grammar with an unsplit infinitive would be ‘to go boldly’. However, the fact is that split infinitives are no longer considered incorrect usage in modern English, provided you are consistent.
/ pedant.
terry9000k said on August 2, 2012
It was an American script of course…!!
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
They might have considered “to boldly go where no human has gone before” because after all, we don’t really know if other beings had been to those places.
GrumpyGriffin said on August 2, 2012
Lets hope that if NEVS do end up making cars with a Saab badge they don’t turn out to be like Muds Women!
Niklas G said on August 2, 2012
+1
Good summary of the situation again, Allan B!
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
That’s interesting. Many of us look at their website and get the distinct feeling that they are in way over their heads—no serious player would have a joke of a website like that. It falls under the category of “if you don’t have anything to say, then don’t say anything.” The website is a big loser. No website would be better than that one.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Geez, speaking of grammar (see other commets above), I think I meant to say “HAVING no website would be better than having that one.”
100%Saab said on August 2, 2012
Time does count. Let’s call it a variation of the military’s “Dear, John letter”. At some time one simply moves on. When Saab restarts production, will there be an extra car in the garage? The longer this goes on the more likely for the loyal Saab owner to move on.
Just a thought.
andyb said on August 2, 2012
Sadly your assuming NEVS have any interest in Saab owners,since they may well have no intention of reviving the Saab brand we are pretty much an irrelevance.
TonymacUK said on August 2, 2012
+1
hilmar said on August 2, 2012
O.k., if it is delayed I will wait with my Saab here. I don´t have negative feelings.
jond said on August 2, 2012
No-one seems to be analyzing this from a Chinese perspective. In truth, I don’t have claim to much insight. However, the Chinese Government have a controlling stake in the company that has a controlling stake in NEVS. So, it seems fair to assume that the production facilities and technology that NEVS will acquire will have to conform to the vision of some Chinese bureaucrats. That vision seems to be to produce high quality EVs that in the medium/long term will lessen pollution in Chinese cities. Fair enough! China is financing this, and who pays the piper calls the tune.
From their point of view, attempting to sustain what has hitherto been a loss-making brand within a presently saturated market might well, therefore, seem like madness, and certainly well away from the primary mission. Knowing the qualities of the brand I think differently, but regrettably I have absolutely no influence whatsoever in this matter.
IMHO the only hope for further development of the brand as we have known it may well rest with some start-up/spinoff operation, yet to be formed or by some future acquisition of the brand and some of its technology by an established motor manufacturer. I think that we may just have to get used to the fact that NEVS has no interest in the fan base, because they plan never to produce cars that will interest it. Or perhaps that will be so far into the future, that they will be trying to develop an entirely new fan base. As an example, I suppose the Jaguar brand may well be the best example of that sort of thing. The present fan base of that brand will be similar types to earlier devotees, but not exactly the same individuals as previously, since most of the latter will have probably passed on by now.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Not sure about the Jaguar analogy. In the U.S., Jaguar never went away (at least in my lifetime). They’ve been offering cars in every model year since I was born, at least I think so. Their cars have always been expensive—-focused on sporty luxury. Same formula, same pricing, same customer base. Obviously, a 50 year old who bought one in 1975 in in their 80s now—-but if they are still rich and still driving, they might still be looking at a Jag for their new car! Doesn’t matter if it’s Jag independent, Jag Ford or Jag Tata or whatever. What we are witnessing here is much, much different. From what we THINK we know—-or from what we can gather from the sketchy information about NEVS—-what they have in mind has absolutely NOTHING to do with what Saab mechanicals were for the last generation or two. Body styles? Not sure yet. When they will be sold? Not for a while I’m afraid. Last model year to next model year? They will be skipping a few, at least—-and we don’t even know if they will be Saab in name. Not the Jaguar situation from what I see.
davidgmills said on August 2, 2012
Man, I just don’t understand this at all. Why build electric cars in Europe for the Chinese? Just makes zero sense. If China really needs electric cars to deal with its pollution problems, the smart thing is to build them where they are needed where labor is less and shipping costs are zero. I don’t understand NEVS buying the factory without the Saab name.
And as far as the government is concerned, its investment in Saab parts is worth a whole lot more if Saab cars are being produced, especially gasoline or diesel cars. Your suppliers if they are supplying your new cars with gasoline and diesel parts are more inclined to keep supply old gasoline and diesel parts.
Sell the plant to Mahindra and let Mahindra make Saabs.
3cyl said on August 2, 2012
It is difficult to understand their rationale, but Nevs put up the money and it makes sense to them. NEVS hasn’t been very forthcoming with information, so perhaps their plan is more extensive than it appears. For the sake of all the former SAAB employees, I hope it does make sense.
terry9000k said on August 2, 2012
Re; Nevs put up the money…
Not yet they haven’t.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
Exactly. By this definition, Youngman put up the money too. In fact, Youngman really did put up money.
Angelo V. said on August 2, 2012
Well, you phrased it all very well and when a deal is this hard to understand—-there is often something going on behind the scenes that would explain it all—-and in this case, I truly feel the explanation wouldn’t sit well with most of us. It DOESN’T make sense to us, because “our” objectives are likely much, much different then THEIR objectives. And I’ll be blunt: The people that made this happen—-I don’t think their objective is for Saab cars to re-emerge as a healthy car company and I don’t think their objective is long term employment in Sweden either. My belief is that it’s a money grab of some sort—-millions of dollars changing hands and some will win and others will lose. Sadly, I think the losers are going to be taxpayers.
scand said on August 2, 2012
I think you are probably right.
Making an elderly internal combustion engine design car all electric doesn’t make much commercial sense.
Making them in a high cost country to ship half way around the world to sell in a low cost country doesn’t make much commecial sense.
Buying a world class factory with probably several hundred milion dollars worth of tooling for around $50m probably does make commercial sense…..if….in the end you can monetarise it.
A business plan about making electric green cars will surely sway the Sweden politicians , far easier than making ” normal” cars will.
What , then, if you start, with all good intentions, but you simply can’t sell more than a few hundreds, not the thousands or tens of thousands you had hoped?
Do you then just keep one token small or test production line going, and then get to monetarise the rest of the valuable equipment…or what?
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
I think so, that’s what you do. And you might drag it out a little bit and ask for help to keep it going. You might say “There’s light at the end of the tunnel” to get government loans of some sort—-even when you know the plan is a bust—perhaps even, intended to be a bust from day one. The dead giveaway to me at this point is that we don’t have a mission statement—-a vision—-out and out enthusiasm on the part of any of the cast of characters we’ve almost been introduced to. Say what you will about Muller (Personally, I’ve said plenty.), but I think he went into it to win. He had a plan and believed in it—-and I think his heart was in the right place and he expected things to turn out better. In this case, no one is going out on a limb—-but more importantly, no one is even saying what they WANT from this, what they expect, how they plan to make it all work—why we will like it, what they will accomplish—-the list goes on. And before anyone chimes in with “I like the quiet way they are moving forward, they’re doing things behind the scenes, getting it right, blah, blah, blah—–” before you say that—-think of some supporting material to explain that. If the plan had anything to do with Saab—-even the most entry level person in the corporate would would know that in addition to buying a factory, you bought a customer base. That entry level person would want to protect the investment by keeping the customer base intact. They are doing absolutely NOTHING to accomplish that.
TonymacUK said on August 2, 2012
I`m with you.
Jasper said on August 2, 2012
-30-
TonymacUK said on August 3, 2012
Don`t understand that -30-.
Ever since I saw that one of the NEVS partners was a Venture Capitalist company I have been nervous about the outcome and suspicious of their motives. This latest news simply strengthens that feeling. Scand seems to think, as I do, ( forgive me if I`m wrong, scand) that there is little chance of NEVS ever producing any vehicles, but could make a small fortune by selling what they have yet to pay for – a bit like selling shares that one has bought, but not yet paid for. If I`m wrong on that and they do actually start producing cars, they won`t be SAABs and they won`t be made with the SAAB passion and that constant search for that something different, something extra.
H.K. Gordon said on August 4, 2012
unfortunately, I agree
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
I find it very hard NOT to agree. Venture Capitalist companies can sometimes initiate great turnarounds—-other times, they move money around to their advantage (perfectly fine—-they’re in this for profit). Buying assets and packaging them for resale—-or “selling what they have yet to pay for” can rake in tidy profits for shareholders/partners, all legally. It’s hard to imagine this bunch (from what we’ve seen and heard so far) is in this to design, build and sell automobiles. Not seeing it. Not feeling it.
scand said on August 4, 2012
venture capital also always goes into a project with question #1 being , ‘how do I get my money back out, and how fast’.
H.K. Gordon said on August 3, 2012
We can all only wait so long, I’m now looking at a Volvo – I don’t see how this company that seemed to come from nowhere, does not pretend to be making Saabs (what are they going to call them?) and now, can’t get their acts together are going to do anything approaching what Saab was. It’s sad, but things do change. I never thought that I would think this way, but this is not good news.
Baver said on August 3, 2012
FWIW, just received a flyer from a local Volvo dealer that says they will give loyalty rebates to both Volvo and Saab owners. I thought it was a nice gesture and probably a smart one at this point in the game.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
I’ve received direct mail from Volvo dealers about giving me high trade in value for my Saab (but I’m not ready to sell) and also telling me they will service my Saab. There might have even been a free oil change offer—-I’d have to look. Since my Saab dealer—or what used to be my Saab dealer—-is still in business, I’m going there for maintenance for now. My dream is for Volvo-Geely to get the name “Saab” and sell one or two “Saab” brand models in Volvo showrooms. They would be engineered and designed in Sweden, possibly manufactured there, or China, or somewhere else. It would be smart business—trying to keep the Saab style/Saab feel and even the Saab name—-but selling alongside Volvo? They would capture 100% of Swedish car fans that way.
JH said on August 3, 2012
Can everybody please remember that NEVS is a company which has announced its intentions to buy certain parts of Saab Automobile’s bankruptcy estate and to whom the bankruptcy administrators have decided to sell, but that no deal has been completed yet and therefore it is only sound that NEVS don’t talk so much about their plans. Why would we even suspect that NEVS lacks the appropriate funding? Why would they have bought 49 hectares of land and buildings in Trollhättan if they planned to use just technology and move everything abroad? Deals like this take a lot of time and we need to wait till it’s finished. When NEVS actually owns anything that used to be Saab they can start talking about their plans and THEN we can judge them. Not now.
JH said on August 3, 2012
If one needs to buy a new car now or within a year or two one has to realize that there most certainly won’t be any new Saab cars available, except maybe stocked cars made last year or finished by ANA. This means that one needs to look at another brand until there hopefully are new and appealing Saabs available. I would probably buy a Mazda or a Volkswagen if I was in such a situatuon, but we’ll keep our two 9-5′s in the family for some time to come. One good thing about last year’s rollercoaster was that it made me a lot more patient, which is quite useful now.
H.K. Gordon said on August 3, 2012
I wouldn’t buy a VW for anything and a Mazda doesn’t do it after driving Saabs – however, your dealer just might have an older Saab on the lot, and if it’s from the GM years, just maybe you’ll actually get parts. I did that in January and it is my “transition Saab” hoping that Saab will come back, but if not, probably Volvo -
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
H.K.: For people willing to buy a used car, this is probably a great time to get a GM era Saab. They have depreciated at a much higher than average rate because of what has happened at Saab and how the bankruptcy was decided, so the deals are there for the taking. People are scared and just trying to get rid of perfectly good cars. I don’t know about parts availabiity—-hopefully it’s good and since these cars sold in reasonable numbers for a quite a few years and didn’t undergo many major body and mechanical changes—-there are used parts available in addition to some new GM shared bin parts—-that situation might be okay. If you’re a used car shopper and you have a decent European brand car mechanic (particularly if you have one that specializes in Saab-Volvo) your idea to buy a used Saab as a transition might be a great solution. But some people are strictly new car buyers—–others drive corporate leased cars that must be new—-and for them, Saab is no longer a choice. That’s a pity. I think if Mahindra had been able to buy Saab—-they would have come to market with product faster than NEVS is going to—and would have sold in more places (such as North America) and would have marketed traditional gas engined cars at reasonable prices (in comparison to expensive battery operated cars). All of this would bode well for Saab owners/enthusiasts. But it didn’t play out that way.
H.K. Gordon said on August 4, 2012
parts are a problem – my brake light blew today, a minor part, and the dealer said think about the end of August – I am not happy
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
If it takes a month to get something as minor and at the same time, critical as a brake light—-that is very scary. Just think if you went in for a state inspection—-that car could very well be off the road with a failed inspection until the brake light arrived. It’s a bummer to hear that.
Rune said on August 4, 2012
There are a number of parts, as I understand it, that has an ETA of August/September. I hope/believe the supply of parts will stabilize around then.
TonymacUK said on August 5, 2012
But surely, HK, that doesn`t have to be a SAAB part?
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Oh, and by the way H.K.: For new car buyers on a budget, if you’re willing to go “downmarket” a bit—-the current Kia Optima (in the U.S. at least) is being offered with best in class power (turbocharged engines or hybrid platforms), very good safety ratings and a 10 year warranty—-at a value price. No, it’s not a Saab—-but it’s a lot of fun for the money and a very nice, practical size. In a lot of ways, it’s what Saab SHOULD have been the last few years. I do understand where some are coming from when they suggest Mazda (and others suggest Subaru) as Saab replacements. Subarus are about the “quirkiest” of the Japanese offerings, though they’ve become too ordinary for my taste. Mazda has the performace/spirited/fun to drive thing going for it—-which is why people equate it with Saab—-but for me, the interiors are boring and the exteriors miss the mark on styling. I know that Kia’s line includes cheapies at the low end that are not in the image of what Saab owners have come to expect in a brand—-but their cars have had good reliability (even the Ford Festivas from the 1980s—-cheap little tin boxes that they were—-are still on the road piling up miles) and their current line has a lot of technology and content for the price.
MeanSabean said on August 4, 2012
Angelo it’s time you join Kia and Hyundai blogs and get off this site! In the last 2 years all you have been doing is raving about these cars. Saab is not a mainstream or cheap car! We are all here because it’s very unique and way above average. So please do us all a favor and stop the Kia Kia Kia Hyundai song!
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Actually, I don’t think I’ve even known about SU for two years. To address your concern—-right now, there are no Saab new cars. There are no plans for new Saab cars. Should the name of the site be changed to “Used Saabs United?” in your opinion? Is the content going to be restricted to discussions about Saab only and no other brands—-so that it will only be about used cars? Saab is not a mainstream car, but it is indeed a cheap one—-selling at 50% off sticker for brand new ones and used car values plummeting like submarines. No new car titles though, or new car warranties. I think it’s very natural for fans of Saab to discuss what they will be buying if no new Saabs are available at a time when they want to buy a NEW car. Some say BMW, others Lexus/Acura—-I’ve seen Mazda and Subaru mentioned, so I piggybacked on that. My reason for bringing up Kia is because it sells at the market position that Saabs sold at when they actually sold enough of them to stay in business in the 50s and 60s. They held their own with “unique” cars going head to head against Volkswagen and smaller/cheaper cars from GM, Ford, Rambler, Chrysler, etc. That’s where some Kias are selling now—-and the ones that are more expensive, closer in price to a recent Saab 9-3, can be had with powerful turbocharged engines, leather seating, power sunroofs, alloy wheels, GPS—-air bags out the wazoo and that 10 year warranty the others don’t offer and never have. Typically, when I’ve discussed it—-I wasn’t the one who brought up the topic, I just responded to someone else’s observations, like I’m doing now.
MeanSabean said on August 5, 2012
Whatever!!!!
SAABBob said on August 3, 2012
Hey Naysayers (you know who you are)…with all due respect, can’t you post anything except negative comments?
I’m the first to admit I haven’t got a clue as to what is really going on. Not a clue. And I bet you don’t either although you seem to think you do and/or that NEVS should be consulting you.
I’m not negative; nor am I positive. But I am hopefull…and patient. As I have said many times here, “keep an open mind, you never know what might fall into it”.
Angelo V. said on August 3, 2012
Right—-and not having a clue of what is really going on is ridiculous. NEVS is a PR nightmare—-”clueless” is a fine description. I refuse to be a Pollyanna.
H.K. Gordon said on August 3, 2012
I’m with you
Allan B said on August 3, 2012
“I refuse to be a Pollyanna!” Angelo, you sound like a panto queen. It is highly entertaining.
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
What’s a panto queen? I might want to start using that term too.
Niklas G said on August 4, 2012
Isn’t it just standard procedure for any serious company not to tell customers and competitors agout the next generation of their products until they are ready to launch?
Wouldn’t it be more of a PR nightmare if NEVS paid some PR agency now to launch some new flashy website and start bragging now about what they want to do with that company they haven’t really bought yet, together with the staff they haven’t hired yet and industrial collaborators they haven’t signed all contracts with yet?
Nah, in my humble opinion, they have already given rather clear information about in what direction they want to go, certainly with some remaining questionmarks left to straighten out (like the one David G Mills pointed out above), but I’d rather prefer them putting all their energy right now into signing all contracts, hiring the necessary staff for continuing development of the Phoenix platform, and make sure to start developing new great cars before telling us about it.
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Niklas: What “energy?” It’s the job of a public affairs or public relations chief to show an organization in a positive light. I’m not talking about NEVS showing their hand or giving possible competitors an edge—-I’m talking about exciting the base by talking in generalities about why we should be excited—-things to look forward too. A successful company has to be able to walk and chew gum. They can’t sign papers while they concurrently talk a good game about the future and how they will do a great job carrying on the legacy of Saab? Have you seen the concept vehicles/prototypes from Kia and other manufacturers, showing what they have planned years into the future? NEVS might not be that far along yet—–to SHOW us anything. But they can at least assure us that they intend to introduce products in the Saab markets that Saab loyalists will want to wait for—–unless that ISN’T in their plans—-which is what is implied by the silence. If they do not plan to sell cars to past and current Saab enthusiasts, in those markets—-in a few years tops—–it should be easy to understand why so many of us see them as jokers/clowns/jive turkeys.
‘
3cyl said on August 3, 2012
If NEVS’ plan includes the SAAB community they are indeed doing a terrible PR job. If their plan has nothing to do with SAAB, they probably see no reason to engage us.
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
Absolutely spot on. I would say one of your two options is probably correct—-and both are bad for most of us.
Allan B said on August 5, 2012
Speak for yourself. NEVS have engaged me. Their PR job is just fine as far as I am concerned. The deal is not yet concluded and, until it is, no reasonable person should expect or require them to say any more.
Angelo V. said on August 5, 2012
Allan: That is great and it sounds as though you’re easy to please—-I think that is somewhat unusual though. Time will tell, but I think NEVS has gotten off on the wrong foot with most of Saab’s existing customer base (those who have actually followed the story). Most of us fear that because NEVS was chosen as the buyer—-we might never see another Saab for sale in our respective markets. Many of us are upset because we don’t think we’ll be ready for a battery operated car in the near future—-and we don’t think battery operated cars will be ready for US in the near future—-and that’s all we have heard that they plan to build or consider building—-no mention of conventional engined cars or hybrids coming anytime soon from them. So a lot of the “evidence” points to a company that wants to bury Saabs body instead of trying to revive it and that’s why I thought “poor PR” was actually giving them the benefit of the doubt—-that they do have plans we like and are just awful at communicating them. But if it’s not poor PR—-then I assume it’s a butchering of what is left of Saab, which makes me sad.
hilmar said on August 4, 2012
Well, NEVS told us what they intend to do and now keep quiet to arrange their business. Better they keep quiet otherwise each word they would tell us would be analyzed and commented from “the experts” in this blog and the media. Too much publicity sometimes ruins a business.
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
What examples do you want to share about too much publicity ruining a business. I’m sure there are far more businesses ruined by not enough publicity/recognition—-sort of like the original Saab and Peugeot Motors America too. If they’ve truly told us all they want to do, I read it as selling battery operated cars in China and if that’s all there is—-good luck to the poor devils.
JerseySaab said on August 4, 2012
Yeah, I have to agree it doesn’t look very good on the face of it. I strongly suspect that NEVS is going to become a black hole for governments to thrown funding into as part of their push to force people into electric cars. But we’re just specatators now, and nones of us has a crystal ball. The only real possibility of meaningful input we have is when NEVS actually offers something for sale. Then we get to vote with our wallets.
RS said on August 4, 2012
What I don’t like about NEVS is that they are basically telling everyone who needs a practical car with range (the most important former Saab customers -like SU’s very own TimR and Rune) to take a hike.
I’m sure if you live in the city and and only drive short stints to the mall there could be reason to be excited about a Swedish built EV -if you want to pay the premium and live in Shanghai or Stockholm.
They haven’t announced they’ll produce hybrids because they have no intentions unless we can change that. If unsigned contracts are preventing them from communicating future plans how could the say Phoenix based EV’s are in the pipeline when Phoenix is only in the minds of certain engineers who were not working for them at the time and they hadn’t even finalized the deal yet?
The website is an insult. It should have at least looked professional even if it had not real information. The companies that are successful selling consumer products MUST hype/promote the operation to the best of their ability or it won’t fly in a modern marketing economy. Good products is just a start. The very same thing killed Saab Automobile.
People buy stuff based on emotions and information they get. The Saab heritage is all NEVS have at this point and are in the process of destroying it by not addressing current owners in any way.
I wonder how they are going to sell these premium priced Japanese/Swedish EV’s that have cut off its ties to the past, even in China?
There is one way to fix this PR disaster the very day the deal is completed. By announcing NEVS backs the warranties for the Spyker-era Saabs and want to keep its current customers buy providing hybrids to bridge into the future.
I don’t think NEVS is going to sell many cars in Asia if it isn’t global player. The have a ton of makes of their own that don’t sell. The Chinese aren’t just going to buy vehicles assembled in Sweden but REAL SAAB cars that are made to survive in Scandinavia (70 degrees C temperature variations for decades and hundreds of thousands of miles) amongst other things. These cars got to be built better no matter what anyone says. The German ones I’ve experienced haven’t done very well and they’re somehow supposed to be superior machines.
One thing gives me a glimmer of hope and that is the fact there is a Volvo trucks guy involved who knows what it takes to build safe and powerful vehicles that last, although Scania is better…
Angelo V. said on August 4, 2012
I agree with everything you said. Regarding the Volvo trucks guy—if his involvement is in vehicle development and his experience will be used to build a true Swedish product that can sell in many markets around the world, that is fantastic. If he’s merely a well paid “face” for some credibility and some future “loans” from the government—-a “useful idiot” if you will (a well paid one though) than it means nothing to fans of Saab.
dezzer said on August 5, 2012
Just had my 2008 aero checked out and the bloody underseal is peeling off…whats that all about then ?. I cant believe a 4year old car with less than 30000 miles on clock is decaying !!!
RS said on August 6, 2012
dezzer, out of interest would that be a THN or Graz 9-3?
In any case I’d had it sprayed with the original coating asap.
dezzer said on August 6, 2012
THN…pretty p…… off about that really, you would’nt expect it so soon, if i lived and drove in Sweden, it would have rusted away by now !!!!
RS said on August 6, 2012
Maybe SU should put up an unofficial ‘Saab Technical Service Bulletin’ page (based on what we find in the used cars) including links to useful sites now that NEVS is running the show…
I’ve had the underpinning of our NG 9-3 treaded every 100-150k km driving on salty winter roads, so 30000 miles shouldn’t do anything. The kids MY97 900 was intact when I last checked.
Contact Saab GB and ask what they know about the stuff used on the face-lift cars.
Sam said on August 6, 2012
The chinese economy is slowing down. Not a good time to start a new car company. It wouldnt surprise me if the NEVS investors decided to “delay the closing” until the economy turns around sometime in the future. BTW, does NEVS have access to all the techology and intellictual property at this time?