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by Swade

The best winter tires video you’ll ever see

November 25, 2010 in Uncategorized

TuuSaR just dropped this one in comments and I’ve rarely ever felt so compelled to share a video on this site.

In the next three minutes you’ll see lots of 90/00′s goodness, some great fast driving on snow and ice…….. in a Saab 9-3 Viggen……… and if you’re really quick, you’ll also see a 3.5 inch floppy disk (to our 13 year old ad competition entrants – ask your parents).

Awesome. The Viggen is awesome. And the tyres are pretty good, too.

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A Viggen story

June 7, 2010 in Saabology

A few weeks ago, the New South Wales branch of the Saab Car Club of Australia held an event. I showed some photos of it last week.

One of the cars that wasn’t included in that group of photos was this beautiful red 900 Aero.

The car belongs to a guy named Wayne G and it’s currently up for sale. Wayne got in touch with the club about selling the car a few weeks before the club event and was subsequently invited to go along, which he did.

Last Friday I was in Sydney and as is normally the case, I caught up with a few of the Sydney Saab fraternity for dinner. Wayne was also invited along to that event and again, he brought along the red 900 for us all to ogle at. It really is quite a special car (and yes, Pete, you should buy it).

Over dinner, one of our SU regulars (and member of the unofficial SU Board) named PT got talking to Wayne, who as it turns out, has owned quite a few Saabs over the years and has a number under ownership right now. In fact, he’s only selling the 900 Aero because he’s just bought another Saab and needs to create some space for it.

The Saab he’s just bought is a 9-3 Viggen and as PT asked him about, it started ringing a few bells – enough for PT to get me involved in the conversation.

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Thursday Snippets – Love The Beast edition

May 6, 2010 in Saabology

I didn’t know Car and Driver were going to do this, so it’s a slight case of fortunate timing.
If you happened to read my reflective piece from last night about the joy of driving and that caused you to do a little reminiscing of your own, then you might want to put pen to paper (i.e. fingers to keys) and enter a competition over at C&D.
All you have to do is write about your first car:

What we want to know from you is a little about your first car: What it was, whether or not you loved it and why. If you’ve lost track of it over the years, would you like to find it again? Feel free to share any memories–good or bad–specific to your first ride.

The prizes will be given at random so everyone’s got a good chance of winning. In case it’s not going to be as random as they say, it’d probably help if your story’s a good one.
The prize pack includes a copy of the film, Love The Beast. This is an essential movie for any gearhead. It tells the story of Eric Bana’s love affair with the Ford Falcon he bought when he was a teenager and crashed twenty-something years later, not too far from where I’m sitting right now, during a leg of the Targa Tasmania tarmac rally. It explores the reasons why blokes get so obsessive about things they love and the bonds that are created through that shared interest. It’s also got some killer driving footage from Tasmania, too.
Click here to enter the competition. And even if you don’t, see if you can get hold of that movie. It really is worthwhile.
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If you’ve got time, here’s some great automotive writing from one of my long-time favourites, PJ O’Rourke. He tackles the Jeep Wrangler.
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Those of you who are affected by the whole Conan/Leno late night TV thing, please leave your prejudices at the door. Your comments on this post about that issue, should you make them, will be deleted because I don’t care.
What I do care about, however, is the Koenigsegg Trevita that Leno had in his garage. The following video will take you on a look around that car, with the tour guide being none other than Christian von Koenigsegg himself.



The car is absolutely amazing and CvK is heck of a dude.
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Viggen owners out there might want to take note of these……
ViggenPedals.jpeg
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If I mentioned a group of red cars on a track, driving in various formations, around the cones and on two wheels, etc, you’d probably think immediately of the Saab Performance Team.
I know Saab have been doing those moves for over 20 years.
I’m not sure how long Cadillac have been doing it for.
hat tip to Andy Rupert.
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I don’t have any sort of Satnav device as I live in a small city and don’t really need it.
But the idea of Darth Vader telling me my route to work has me thinking a TomTom might be a good idea.

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‘Viggen’ to become a tuning arm of Saab?

March 31, 2010 in Saabology

There’s one review that’s doing the rounds of some of the bigger magazines. We first saw it thanks to Edmunds Inside Line just over a week ago. It appeared in Winding Road earlier this week and now, it’s in Auto Express.
The review was written by a guy named Matt Davis and it seems he’s sold the story to various publications with the right given to them to edit it and change it around so it appears a little different each time.
The interesting thing about this latest iteration is the following, which I don’t recall from previous publications:

Already, there’s virtually no turbo lag when you plant your right foot – something that’s set to improve further when a twin-turbo version prepared by Saab tuning arm Viggen goes on sale. “The Viggen name should play a significant role in Saab’s future,” Muller said.

VignTop92.jpg Now, I do recall the Viggen being mentioned in regard to the 9-5 in the Inside Line article, but I don’t recall the Viggen name being regarded as the future tuning arm of Saab.
Not that I’d be disappointed to see more of the Viggen. I think the Viggen badge has heaps of currency amongst the Saab faithful and I’m overjoyed at the prospect of some mad machinery with the bumble-bee triangle on it.
But will there only be a Saab 9-5 Viggen, or a whole Viggen line through the Saab range?
Quote:

There will also be a high-performance Viggen version of each new model.

Interesting…..

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Saab 9-3 Viggen at autocross – it’s not a BMW

March 27, 2010 in Saabology

I don’t know how many of you Saab owners have been autocrossing before. It seems to be the realm of the RWD owner, mostly. A quick scan of Dan’s Racing Ready archives will show plenty of BMWs and Miatas, amongst other things.
So when SU reader, Jose, turned up to a local autocross meeting in his Saab 9-3 Viggen Convertible, he was met with a few sniggers and a sign-in judge who actually said to him “You’re racing a Saab?! I don’t want to hear another Saaaaaab story when the times sheets come in. Its not a BMW!” as he completed his registration.
ViggenAcross1.jpg
Jose didn’t mind. In true Saab Spyker style he just got in there, got his hands dirty and did the job he came to do – competing in the autocross. The Viggen looked pretty darn good, too, don’t you agree?
ViggenAcross2.jpg
I’ll let Jose take the story from here…..

Afterwards the same organizers were giving out the trophies and announcing the winners. “In first place, Jose in a Saab?!?!” When I went up to receive my trophy, the douchebag again said, “You may have won first, but its still no BMW!” I calmly responded, “Thank god for that!”

ViggenAcross3.jpg
ViggenAcross4.jpg
The winning margin was just 1/10th of a second, but that’s enough.
My heartfelt congratulations to Jose for showing what a well-sorted Viggen can do and for putting some of the nay-sayers in their place.
And for looking so darn good in that Viggen whilst doing it, too :-)

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by Swade

Viggen soft-top ‘pop’ – problem?

February 18, 2010 in Saabology

Quijote has just posted this one in comments and as it’s a prospective purchase (of a Viggen, no less) I figured time was of the essence…..

I just came across a beautiful Viggen convertible that I think I may snatch up.
In fact I was about to pull the trigger when I receive this video, as requested, of the soft top motion. There is a pretty loud pop when the lid opens up, whether the top is folding in or out of the compartment. Can you please check out the video, I’d like your opinions on what that may be.
Cause for concern?
Hydraulic leak?
Soft top failure on the way?
Or just an annoying noise, but nothing to worry about like the dreaded SIDs?
I previously owned a 9-3 SE and Viggen convertible and it never made this noise, although the 9-3 SE did suffer from quite a few soft top failures, the Viggen was solid.
Your thoughts? Can you post them here please?

And here’s the video:



Any of you convertible owners with similar issues, please feel free to advise.

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by Swade

Friday Snippets – treading water edition

January 22, 2010 in Saabology

Yes, we’re still treading water.

Here are the rules, for those of you busting your F5 key.

If Saab are to be closed, I will report that as soon as I hear it. There’s nothing left to lose at that point.

If Saab are sold, then I will not say a thing about it prior to an official announcement, other than reporting solid news broken elsewhere that I can verify. That’s news, not speculation.

As a blogger, I would love to break the news first and ‘stick it to the man’, etc. But the whole company’s future is in the balance here and there’s no way I’m going to risk annoying GM just for the sake of a scoop.

So if you’re hearing nothing, that means all is progressing as far as I’m able to tell. I know that’s not the answer some were looking for, but it’s the only one I’ve got.

——

Our site sponors, State of Nine, attended the Brookline MA convoy and have a gallery of images up on their website from the event.

They’re also helping to publicise the next round of convoys with direct mailouts to clients, etc.
In addition to all that, they’re also offering a 9% rebate on purchases, not including shipping, until 11:59PM Sunday January, 24th.

To claim the rebate, you simply select your items as you normally would, then add the 9% rebate product to your shopping cart. They will take the 9% off once they see that item in your cart.

Thanks again to State of Nine for the support.

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And whilst we’re speaking of sponsor’s products…..

A few nights ago, a friend of mine here in Hobart tuned his 2006 Saab 9-3 Aero V6 with new Maptuner plug-in device.

I have video of the tune, which I’m going to process and upload as soon as I can get hold of the right cable to go between my camera and my Macbook (why don’t they use the same Firewire port as my old iMac had? Frustrating).

Needless to say, though, the tuning process was quick, and the car is now very quick.

Maptuner has just become available for Trionic7 engines!

You can read about another Maptuner experience here (that’s SU regular, PT and his 9-3 SportCombi).

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I received an email a few nights ago from a guy here in Australia, wanting to know some details about the Viggen I crashed and wrote off a few years ago.

Yesterday, I came to understand why.

My old Viggen is for sale.

To save having to answer any more emails on the subject (not that I mind, it’s just quicker this way)….

  • I’m quite sure, 99.999999% sure, that this is my old car.
  • I had what I believe to be a serious crash in it at a driver training day back in 2007.
  • It was written off by my insurer and sold at auction.
  • If you’re considering buying it, you should assure yourself that the repairs have been done to a very high standard. Both the chassis and rear axle were bent after the accident and whilst a rear axle is pretty easy to replace, chassis straightening is a little more tricky.

Viggen4sale.JPG

The car was definitely repairable and it was running like a dream when it crashed.

Just make sure you do your homework and satisfy yourself that the repair has been done to a proper standard. An independent inspection by a quality body shop should do the trick.

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by Swade

Saab 9-3 Viggen vs Saab Turbo X

October 9, 2009 in Saabology

Oh, what a sweet dilemma….
Seth has sent me an email with the following:
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Here’s a small back story: I bought my 5 door black on black 2000 Viggen in ’05, & have put over 60k miles on her. I’ve done a lot of work; Viggen rescue kit, rear ARB, upgraded rear brakes, SS brake lines, iPod input, bluetooth kit, etc etc. More recently however, I’ve been doing more repairs, than preventative maintenance. It’s 10 years old, so stuff is starting to break. I’m beginning to wonder if I should trade up…
Do you think a Turbo-X is a worthy “upgrade” from the Viggen? It would be newer, presumably under warranty…but then again, it will eventually be 10yrs old too, just like my Viggen now…
What are your thoughts?

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I’ll write here what I wrote to him in my email response:
Keep the Viggen and get the Turbo X anyway!!
Unfortunately, Seth’s finances don’t allow for such a dream situation so in tale worthy of the wisdom of Solomon, he has to choose between two awesome machines.
The Saab 9-3 Viggen is an incredibly flawed vehicle, which is why I love it so much. With the right modifications it goes from incredibly flawed to simply incredible and it sounds like Seth has done a lot of that work and added some more creature comforts as well.
The Turbo X is a superior vehicle in every way, but whilst my seat time in an X is limited, I have to wonder if I could love one the way I’ve loved a Viggen. Has it got the personality?
I’m quite sure the big exhaust note, sports seats and incredible grip could wash away the pain eventually, but I’d be moving heaven and earth to keep the Viggen as well as get the Turbo X. At least sell it to a friend so you can keep an eye on it and buy it back in the future.
Get the X. But prepare to miss the Viggen more than you could imagine possible.
Them’s my thoughts. Please provide your own wisdom for Seth in comments.

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by Swade

More Viggen DIY – installing a rear anti-roll bar

October 2, 2009 in Saabology

Mike900 is a Viggen owner living in Melbourne, Australia, and he’s been kind enough to let us sit in on a few of his recent DIY adventures. This fix actually happened around a month ago, but preparations for the Frankfurt show got in the way of me posting it straight away.
Previous installments included acquiring all his bits, and installing the steering rack clamp and brace.
My thanks to Mike for the photos and writeup. I’m going to have to get me one of these for the Monte pretty soon :-)
And it should be noted that whilst Mike owns a Viggen, the mods that he’s doing are standard fare for all Saab 900/9-3 models, from 1994-2002.

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It’s been about a week since I’ve installed (and been delighted with) the new steering rack clamp and brace. Having had enough time to get used to the new feel of the car, I figured it was about time to get cracking on the next step in the process…… the new 22mm Rear Anti-Roll Bar, or ARB for short. This part was bought from Taliaferro Saab in the USA – www.genuinesaab.com
A little about the product:
22mm refers to the diameter thickness of the bar, and is the default size aftermarket ARB sold by Taliaferro. It is also the most popular size for the NG900 and 9-3 models. Taliaferro are also able to produce other sizes ranging from 19mm up to 25mm to suit your specific needs where applicable. There is a very helpful and informative description on their product page here – as well as a great article written by Nick Taliaferro about the trial & testing phase when designing their ARB here.
This bar is thicker than the standard piece that comes with your Saab, and while the ARBs purpose is mainly to reduce the amount of body roll present while driving, it also improves other handling aspects too. The part comes in a silver powder coat (a form of painting), cost $90 USD, and would have also come with free shipping if I had lived in the USA. It comes with a very clear set of instructions which are easy to follow too….. it even had a few colour pictures.
You could easily do this installation using only the instructions supplied, so I’ll breeze through the installation and focus on a few of the easily solvable problems I had. As previously with the steering clamp & brace I’ve uploaded a bunch of extra pictures, in higher quality and each with descriptions on Flickr to save Swade some bandwidth – http://www.flickr.com/photos/mike900/sets/72157622218582355/ (but you can click any of the images below to enlarge and see normal res versions – SW)
Here are the parts as delivered, the bar itself with four nuts and bolts:
ARBPic1.jpg

My Installation experience:
This was FAR easier than installing the steering rack clamp and brace, and took 45 minutes from beginning to end including photos. If I had to compare the level of difficulty to something, I’d say this was no more involving than changing a wheel after a flat tyre. Really, really easy from beginning to end. In fact the only problem I had was nothing to do with the product at all…… it was the Viggen body kit that was the main obstacle. Let me explain.

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Mike900 does more Viggen DIY – installing a steering rack clamp and brace

September 9, 2009 in Saabology

Mike900 – an Australian Viggen owner – is currently doing some upgrades to this Saab 9-3 Viggen and he’s invited us to join him on the ride.

Part 1
involved him getting all the bits together and fitting the new center armrest and billet aluminium oil cap.
Part 2 is a much more complex job – fitting a new steering rack clamp and brace. This magic bit of kit will eliminate most of the average 9-3 owner’s torque steer problems. If you’re curious, read on.
You can also see bigger and clearer photos at Mike’s Flickr account

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DIY Part 2 – Steering rack clamp & brace
You can find a tonne of comments about the steering rack clamp and brace on the web. I’m willing to bet you that every one of those comments is positive, and I’ll tell you now that all the praise is justified. It is just the prettiest, simplest, most rewarding, most effective, most brilliant and wonderful piece of automotive engineering I think I’ll ever know…..EVER!
I am thrilled with the difference it has made, and I doubt the feeling will die down any time soon. I was a little worried going into this installation that I was going to be disappointed with the end results……. I couldn’t have been more wrong.
I’ll share some thoughts on the effect of this great part later on, but for now, let’s get to the installation.
Let me start off by stating anybody is capable of doing this installation, it was not without a few minor difficulties though. It will require some effort and patience, it can be fiddly and frustrating at times, but it is absolutely within the average non-mechanical persons’ capabilities. I am not a trained mechanic, it’s entirely possible that a Saab technician will point out my mistakes, but everything I have done was either from the printed instructions I received with the parts, or from the wonderful technical forums at www.saabscene.com and www.saabcentral.com.
The entire job took 2.5 hours from beginning to end, from the time I walked into the garage to when I took it out for a victory test drive. That time also included my stuffing up several times on a few steps, before working out how to make it work on the 3rd or 4th attempt. If you learn from my mistakes you could do this in half the time or less.
This is the location of the torque steer inducing monster deep within every Saab NG900 & 9-3 engine bay. Sadly, the loose grip of that little metal band with rubber lining allows the steering rack to slide horizontally left and right, while the squashy rubber lining permits flexing backward and forward, as well as upward and downward. This permits slight movements in the wheel angle causing sloppiness and torque steer:
RackClamp1.jpg
Here’s what I’m installing in its place, blue bit is the clamp, long silver bit is the brace. The clamp will hold the steering rack firmly to there’s no sliding or flexing, while the brace adds further support by connecting the unit to the nearby wheel arch:
RackClamp2.jpg

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Saab Pride – Florida Style

August 10, 2009 in Saabology

Saab Pride Most of the journo’s don’t “get it” when it comes to Saab. That’s why it’s up to the owners to tell their Saab stories and take pride in their ride.
You can view all the Saab Pride stories by clicking on the button at the bottom of the right sidebar. It looks just like the graphic on the left.
Today’s pride entry comes from Gerald G and family, in Florida. Like many of you, Gerald has enjoyed 20-plus years of Saab ownership and is still loving his Swedish metal.

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Our Saab Story began in 1987 with the purchase of a 1987 9000 Turbo. We have had several Saabs since then.
We kept the 87 for 11 years and our youngest son drove it the last 2 years. It was sold with 196k miles and was in very good shape.
I purchased a 1999 Viggen with 5 miles on the clock 7/10/1999 and have driven it to 104k miles since. My wife has a 2007 9.3 SC w/26k miles, that she really loves. Attached are some pictures of our present Saabs.
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Sometimes you just need to stop and stare when you see a car as brilliant looking as this. What a mecace!
Click any of the photos to enlarge.
99 VIGGEN 6 22 2004.jpg
The well-chosen rear plate…..
99 VIGGEN Geral.jpg
The family within the family…..
07 AERO SC 99 VIGGEN 10 23 2008.jpg
And some steady driving at 70mph whilst the odometer clicks over 100,000 miles.
Viggen 100K44-2008.jpg
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My thanks to Gerald for the images and the story!

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by Swade

Thursday Night Quick Snippets – King Edition

July 9, 2009 in Archive

I’m got about 10 minutes left on my prepaid web connection………but I’ve managed to schedule a few entries that will pop up in the coming hours, so keep checking in.
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I don’t know how many of you Swedes read King Magazine. I’m guessing it must be some kind of mens mag.
Anyway, apparently they’ve listed the Saab 9-3x as one of their 10 Favourite Things in their July edition.
A skewiff scan of a very nice image:
9-3xKingMagasin.jpg
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You’ve probably seen it elsewhere already, but for the record, here’s a photo of the last Saab 9-5 sedan of the current generation.
It was built last Friday and is a RHD model destined for the UK.
Last Saab 9-5 Sedan_July2 2009 (1).jpg
And yes, I think the reason I didn’t get this when everyone else did is because I showed the 9-5 CGIs. Contact has been re-established and is cordial.
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And finally, for you Viggen-o-philes, there’s a good writeup about it over at Examiner.com (with Video)

Beginning with the rally heroics of the insect-like 96, and continuing through the feisty 99 Turbo and 900 SPG, the carmaker certainly has a penchant for creating some thrilling cars. But those aforementioned machines all pale in comparison to the most raw and rowdy front-drive Saab ever built: the epic 9-3 Viggen.

Amen. I still miss mine everyday.
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Have a good day. See you on the other side.

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by Swade

Sunday Snippets – the kitchen sink edition

July 5, 2009 in Archive

Here’s something I didn’t know:
The Saab factory team still holds the Pikes Peak Open Class hillclimb record.
I’m not sure which run it was, but the 2002 run by Per Eklund in a 9-3 Viggen was pretty darn good. You can see the video here. Wait until about 3:20 when you get to the in-car camera so you can see just how scary-fast that car actually was.
Yes, PT, you should buy that Viggen.
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One of our Aussie Saabnuts and former Chairman of the Saab Car Club of Australia – AlAero – is in Sweden at the moment and is loving it.
“Sleds everywhere!” was the email I got.
He hits Trollhattan on Monday so if you’re there and you see a dark haired bloke with a funny accent at the Saab Museum, go up and say G’day.
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One of European mates, Z!, whipped up a pretty good sketch of the 2010 Saab 9-5 wagon back when the spyshots came online.
He’s now turned his hand to the sedan, which is once again, looking good.
Z-2010-Saab9-5-1.jpg
Z-2010-Saab9-5-2.jpg
I’m not sure we’ll get the Nesbitt-nose on this one (the U-shaped swoop on the hood a-la the 9-3) but these do look really good.
And isn’t the look of pencil on paper somewhat akin to the warmth of music on vinyl?
More of Z’s work is available on Flickr – and in bigger sizes, too.
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Ezra Dyer is a young automotive writer who’s already established a considerable reputation. I love his work and don’t get to see enough of it.
His latest print work is in Automobile Magazine, where he’s written a piece from the point of view of a sad General Motors that has to get rid of it’s favourite Swedish project car because the wife says it’s taking up too much room and he’s never going to finish it, yada yada yada.
If your local news stand sells Automobile, look for the August edition.
Click to enlarge this snippet. The last line’s a doozy.
EzraDyerSaab.jpg
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It looks like there’s a new magazine in Germany with a feature on the Saab Sonett.
The webpage is here, though the online preview doesn’t show the Saab.
SonettMagasin.jpg
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Who’s seen Transformers 2?
Did you spot an Aero-X in there? I didn’t think so.
There were several websites last year that were adamant that there was going to be a Saab Aero-X in Transformers 2, despite evidence to the contrary. I won’t mention them here but this is a small, subtle reminder that linkbaiting false stories is a no-no and the results will be noticed.
Big daddy swadediddly is watching…..
——

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by Swade

Wednesday night Snippets – Saab F1 edition

June 25, 2009 in Archive

Did anyone place a bet with Ladbrokes betting agency a few weeks ago when they offered odds on potential Saab buyers?
You’d have got 5-to-1 on a Swedish consortium buying Saab. I think Koenigsegg qualifies to win that bet, despite the Norwegian and US interests. I’d have lost my money if I had placed a bet as I thought Renco would have been GM’s choice, even though they weren’t mine.
Ladbrokes are now offering odds as to whether Saab will enter Formula 1 under Koenigsegg’s ownership before 2013. I think I’d stay away from that one, but you never know.
BTW – it looks like F1 participants are all enjoying a group hug with Bernie again today. Max Mosely is nowhere to be seen, though I’m sure News Of The World will find out how he’s choosing to soothe his separation anxiety.
Thanks Joyrider!
——
The Saab Newsroom are asking which future Saab you’re most looking forward to.
They talk a little about the showroom of the future, which was viewed by potential buyers. It contained top-secret cars as well as the ones we know about. One of those top-secret cars was a Russelsheim derived model of a future 9-3, though as I understand it, it may not be the final product.
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Tesla have received almost half a billion dollars in US tech loans to help them build the Model S four door electric car. The money has to be repaid by 2022.
Call it a matter of national pride, but shouldn’t the Swedish government consider this an incentive to try and help Koenigsegg and Saab build the Quant and beat Tesla at their own electric game?
Personally, I’m not sure the Quant is anywhere near ready enough to come to series production soon, but I’m for helping them try.
Thanks Karen!
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Saab social networking?
Our unofficial Saab Ambassador to the UK, Robin M, has recently started up Saab Friends, where you can make new…..Saab Friends and catch up with old or current…..Saab Friends.
It’s only been up for a week and there’s 26 members so far, so you’ll be getting in early. I’m just hopeless with these things and haven’t joined up, though I do intend to. I might wait and see if I can be member #99 :-)
——
From Flickr:
ViggenFrance.jpg

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by Swade

Saab and sludge – something I didn’t know

March 26, 2007 in Saabology

Just quickly perusing the news services and saw this article on oil sludging.
As many of you know, the early 9-5s and 9-3 Viggens were both prone to sludging issues if not maintained correctly. Anyone who’s considering the purchase of one of these models should have the car checked over quite thoroughly, even to the point of removing the sump for a visual inspection.
Saab do have some coverage for this problem, and the article I’ve just been reading covers the various makes with sludging issues and the recourse available to owners of said makes.
But here’s one thing I didn’t know…..

A lack of adequate oil changes is the explanation for damage given by Audi, Lexus, Saab, Toyota and VW. Yet unlike Chrysler and Dodge, those automakers have formal compensation programs for sludge damage, although in some cases consumers must provide detailed service records — and in the case of Saab, must have used oil filters sold only by the company.


My emphasis added.
I knew about the need for regular services and keeping a record thereof, but I didn’t know about the need for OEM oil filters only. What happens if your dealer didn’t have one in stock and you really needed the car that day?
That may be far-fetched, but still….

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