When I first heard about Saab mounting the new DI 2.0T engine from the 9-5 in the 9-3 Griffin, I just thought with a little help from Switzerland, that car could be the perfect Viggen successor. Later I learned that Hirsch was updating that engine to 260hp/400Nm not only in the 9-5 but also in the 9-3. From that day I knew the Saab 9-3 Griffin FWD 2.0T + Hirsch will be the most fun to drive Saab since years.
I still have to drive it, but Till72 had the pleasure last Friday. You can read his thoughts after the jump.
Flying the Griffin
At first I’d like to take you a back in time. It was in ten years ago when I bought my first new Saab. It was a 9-3 SE with 185 hp, a Turbo Anniversary model if I remember correctly. I really loved that car, it was extremely quick, a bit raw with lovely torque steer but still great on long trips. When I got the car back then the first thing I did was taking a trip through Sweden, up to the polar circle, using as many dirt roads as I could find. I did nearly 10.000 km within a bit more than two weeks – still one of my most favourite road trips. I enjoyed that car for two years and as the lease ended I stepped on to the next generation of the 9-3.
I think that either with my own cars or loaners I got, I’ve driven about every engine that have been available for the current 9-3 and despite many were more powerful and for sure all of them were more refined than my good old hatch none had that special driving feel (it’s hard to describe but I guess many here know what I mean).
Now let’s fast forward a bit to last Friday. I went to Sankt Gallen to visit Manfred at Hirsch. As we had a coffee he handed over a key and said “This is what we will be driving today!” I instantly had a smile on my face and asked “Griffin? 260 hp?” He confirmed that and after we had done some business stuff it was finally time to take a ride and find a place for lunch. To be able to do a proper test, we chose a place a bit higher in the mountains.
Manfred lead me out of Sankt Gallen and as soon as we got out on those winding Swiss roads and I put my foot down I got a driving feel like I had it back in my first 9-3. On the entire trip the highest gear I used was 3rd – it was just pure fun to accelerate out of the bends and dare traction until the ESP smoothly stepped in. When accelerating on quite steep hills it feels like the road was flat and overtaking is pure fun. With 260 hp and a torque of 400Nm you always have plenty of power without any turbo lag and if you already smile from ear to ear with the standard 2,0T you may smile all around with the Hirsch upgrade.
The car was FWD so of course you have some torque steer and some amount of under-steer in sharp bends but I have to admit that I like that behaviour, it makes the driving experience less clinical.
For I am one of those who think that a Saab has to be a 4-cylinder, at least in the 9-3, this car is just perfect. May I call it ultimate driving machine? 😉 Since my ride in that car a few days have passed but I am still smiling. Yesterday I went on an off-road quad tour which was great but it didn’t exceed the amount of fun I had on Friday.
You got to know me as someone who always was asking for a XWD Diesel. But last Friday changed my view a bit. When it comes to driving fun, that car, maybe with some additional Hirsch goodies regarding suspension and wheels, would be just perfect for me. I’d recommend the update to all who got/get a 9-3 with the latest 2,0 T. Your dealer can install a ten day trial software as soon as it’s available (homologation is still to be finished) but be aware: it’s quite likely you may want to keep it.
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I’m sorry for the TurboX fans, but the new Kid on the block has arrived. 🙂
260HP + FWD + Crappy gearbox + not lightweight car + 2011 does not sound promising. It can be performance car for honda civic driver or something..
Doctor,
what was the Viggen?
Viggen was nice special pack for the crappy car. Looking at 900NG/9-3 Euroncap makes me feel that it was not saab at all. And the performance level was allright in 80s and early 90s for 9000 but not special for viggen.
I think the right viggen was the one which was in rally with 2.2~ 0-100 time, xwd and stronger body.
Well doctor,
what can you (seriously) prescribe then…
it is pack for 9-5 which can beat RS6. E AMG and M5
Or same pack for NEW 9-3. Current one is too old for that kind of official tunes.
My 274Hp BSRed “FWD, crappy gearbox, not lightweight car” embarrassed a 2010 330hp, rear wheel drive Infiniti G37 three weekends ago at the autocross.
And he had to fill up his tank long before I did.
G37 shit, not fast car. seen it owned by 240HP hirsch 9-3. i owned much better cars with 9-5 350hp but still think my car is outdated a lot in performance: 1. bad AT gearbox. 2. FWD (ok NG solved this problem) 3. low power for factory
I’d like to see SAAB in RS6 AMG M league, not in one with jap crapp cars.
My 250Hp Maptun-ed “FWD, crappy gearbox, heavyweight car” embarrassed a Porsche Boxster few weeks ago. Simply the Porsche’s young driver could not believe that a “heavy” Saab could overtake him and he could not catch me up whatever he tried.
Just in a straight line, Chris, just in a straight line….
My 9-3 cab “FWD, crappy gearbox, not lightweight car” embarrassed a 2010 Porsche Cayman S cab from 50 to 150 with a roundabout in the middle of the “track”. The driver looked very disturbed after the race.
LOL!
What an appetizer!
Thank you Till!
SAAB have a goal of 110kw per litre cubic capacity. In terms of power that makes the Viggen a bit of slug with a mere 73kw per litre. However get behind the wheel and the Viggen is far from sluggish even by today’s offerings. At 260hp the Hirsch tunes 9-3 is pushing 130hp which is pretty much the benchmark for most high-ouput turbocharged engines on the market today. Is there room for a bit more in the new DI 2.0Ltr? I’d like to think so, the question is who would want 300hp from a 9-3 and lastly would it be… Read more »
I’m pretty sure that ther would be room for a bit more in the DI 2,0 but the 260 hp but the question is durability. 260 hp should be a safe number regarding that.
WooDz,
VW has presented its 2013 WRC contender, a Polo with a 300hp 1.6 Turbo engine, thus the 2.0L DI Engine should be capable for more. But Hirsch is not the tuning company that will do it. Maybe Maptun will offer such an über-Monster, but then only XWD will make sense, making the car heavier.
Who’d want a 300 hp 9-3? Well just look at the nuts who’ve been buying Lancer Evos and Imprezas through the years.
I think Saab needs an XWD rally-inspired car with loads of horsepower to take advantage of their rally heritage.
A little off topic, but:
” It was in ten years ago when I bought my first new Saab. It was a 9-3 SE with 185 hp, a Turbo Anniversary model if I remember correctly.”
My saab is a 2002 9-3 SE Aut, how can I find out if it has the 150 hp engine or the 185 hp engine?
The instruction manual does not mention gear box alternatives for the 150 hp, only for the 185 hp and the 205 hp. I’ve had it for 2 1/2 years and I’ve never missed more power. Fun car to drive. 🙂
Audun,
the 150hp version did not have a turbo gauge.
Thank you! I didn’t se that in the manual (now I see it). My car has a 2.0 Turbo Ecopower, so then it has 185 hp. 🙂
But you can also use a VIN decoder like this, in case you are not sure.
Thank you! The decoder says: Engine type: B205E LPT, 150 hp
Was there a 150 hp 2.0 Turbo Ecopower?
I think 2.0 Turbo Ecopower was a general naming for all B205 engines.
The manual says:
“2.0t Ecopower (150 hp), 2.0 Turbo Ecopower , (185 hp), …”
Perhaps the first 150 hp is a low pressure turbo? My car doesn’t have the “turbo” needle in the instument panel.
Yes, there was: 150 HP = 2.0 litre with low-pressure turbo (LPT), just as yout VIN says 🙂 . 185 HP = 2.0 litre with full-pressure turbo (FPT). The only differences are the ECU software and the absence (LPT) resp. presence (FPT) of the turbo pressure gauge. It’s also possible the 3-way valve (a.k.a. APC solenoid valve) was absent in the/some lpt versions. Ecopower was, I believe, at the time Saab’s kind of generic name for all turbocharged engines. There were also 2.3 Ecopowers. I’m not sure, though, whether the Aero’s were also referred to as Ecopowers. I do know… Read more »
3d line from bottom: 185 HP….
Ivo
Thant you ivo 71 for the explanations! My youngest son has a 2001 9-5 wagon with a 2.3 Ecopower. 🙂
150 hp is more than OK for me, I mostly drive alone in it with just a little cargo. 🙂
2.0t (lower case t) was the 150, 2.0T (upper case T) was the 185. Ecopower became the branding for all Saabs turbo petrol engines if I recall correctly.
@Audun, if you can light up the front tyres in 3rd at 70, it’s a 185! 😀
@Romac, can you exlain this to me: ” @Audun, if you can light up the front tyres in 3rd at 70, it’s a 185! ”
In 3rd, I have a 4 speed aut.
The engine is marked with 2.0t. 🙂
SAAB is not about 2 + 3 + 4 -3.
SAAB is about driving and enjoying it.
People, you gotta get behind the wheel of those cars and drive them.
Otherwise, you’ll end up doing the maths without knowing what SAAB or Viggen or Aero means.
Sorry, my last posting was aimed @Doctor Donk.
I know RedJ, Audun & Till72 don’t need that tkind of encouragement.
Yes, there is a lot of power-room left on that engine… only torque has to pay the penalty.
If you compare (engine)competitors.
Lancer EvoX: 295Hp – 366Nm torque
Audi S3: 265HP – 350Nm
Seat cupra: same as Audi S3.
Seat Supercopa (race car): 300HP – 350Nm fuel consumption: 55l/h
Seat Supercopa (race car) with upgrade: 330HP – 370NM fuel consumption 60l/h
These are all 2.0 DI Turbo engines…
I’ll take 260Hp and 400Nm anytime!!
No need for the horsepowers, but give me the torque!!!
What about the engine life time after such an upgrade?
Nothing to worry about with the Hirsch upgrade. 260HP does not overly stress the engine components. If you go for 300HP or more, I would take a closer look at internal components and most importantly exhaust temperature. When exhaust temperature is too high, you’ll need to tweek your fuelsystem in order to keep it under control. Excessive exhaust temperature will reduce the life time of your turbo. It mostly means that the injector takes too long time to inject the amount of fuel needed. Bigger injectors or higher fuelpressure is then needed. Since we already have a high pressure pump,… Read more »
Agree on the Hirsch part for Choosing wisely. I would probably do so if I bought a new Saab
For more pure fun , call Maptun, wreck your warranty on your OG9-3 taking it to steg 3 or 4, or get a Viggen at steg 3…
Low weight and FWD rules 🙂
@Doctor Donk..We have a street legal Maptun 500HP 9000 in our club. Would that do the trick for 2011?
Are any OG9-3’s still under warranty? 🙂
Nah probably not..the 8 year oil sludge thing just ran out I think
OK..then go to steg 5 on OG9-3. The standard clutch and GT17 Turbo probably needs replacement anyway 🙂
A provocative headline to be sure, but it’s definitely no Viggen successor. I have a Turbo-X and it’s certainly no Viggen successor either. The Viggen was not only high performace, but it also had a certain look and a certain kind-of crazy attitude about it that no Saab since (certainly not the upcoming Griffin, even if it’s Hirsched) has embodied. I actually think Saab should choose a different moniker for its future high performance models (assuming they’re able to make any). Autos today are just too big, too heavy, and too refined to recapture that light, tossable, slightly dangerous feel… Read more »
@till72 – I hope you realize how much I hate you right now….:)
On the other hand, I shouldn’t complain, I’m more than happy with the 9-5. If only more people would get to test-drive a Saab, the problems would be solved, money would start pouring in, but I guess it just too much bad press.
Nice report!
Sometimes it even feels good to be hated…. 😉
You got the hirsched 9-5 Aero, right? Also a great car. Take a look at the body kit when it comes out, it just looks great.
btw.: We share a dealer, right?
Yup, we do have the same dealer. I’ll give the body kit a look, but I think the car looks great already. See what I mean?
I wouldn’t trade it for anything else, but I’m greedy and I want to drive them all 🙂
Really looks great. The body kit gives it a bit of a more, err, evil touch and it has some aerodynamic purpose. I like it a lot. Will try to get some preview for SU soon.
A preview of this one. 😛
@Red J
Yep, and a bit more…
Yes, Till. Sounds like you had a lot of fun! My first new Saab (and first Saab, actually) was a 2000 9-3 and like you, the first week of driving it convinced me it was the most fun car I had ever owned. 176,000 miles later…..it still is! 🙂
I saw a 9-3 Troll Convertible for sale last week. If I only had some spare bucks…