Press Release: Nevs grows with two Chinese strategic part owners

Together with two new Chinese part owners Nevs will establish its second global factory with focus on electric vehicles and a second global research and development center in the city of Tianjin, neighboring Beijing City and Hebei Province, three highly-integrated economic regions with a population over 100 million.

With the new part owners, Tianjin city’s Tianjin Binhai Hi-tech industrial Development Area (THT), and the Beijing State Research Information Technology Co., Ltd. (SRIT), Nevs has got two new strategic partners.

Tianjin is one of the biggest coastal cities in China and has significantly promoted new energy vehicles both in the form of consumer subsidies and official procurements.

The Tianjin city’s fast growing national level demonstration zone THT embraces a long history of automotive industry. Here is where the joint venture production plant will be built. This will give Nevs a strong foothold on the increasing EV market in the area and China, as well as provide Nevs access to the existing automotive supplier base in the region.

SRIT is a pioneering IT service provider owned by China’s Research Development Center of the State Council, and the telecommunications giant China Unicom.

As software services and connectivity as well as new energy vehicles are the major and increasing trend within the automotive industry, the cooperation with SRIT and its owners will give Nevs a unique possibility to place itself at the forefront of connectivity for the future. SRIT as a partner will also open up more opportunities for Nevs.

The first car that will be produced in the plant in Tianjin is an electric vehicle based on Nevs’ technology, followed by a diversified EV and portfolio of battery electric vehicles and EVs based on Nevs’ new developed vehicle architecture.

“Nevs’ focus is to produce high quality electric vehicles with China as its initial main market. The long-term cooperation with the development area THT in Tianjin and the IT pioneer SRIT will help us achieve our vision and our goal of a global strategic presence and is an important addition to the resources we have in Trollhättan”, says Nevs president Mattias Bergman.

Mikael Östlund
Director Communications and Public Affairs

107 thoughts on “Press Release: Nevs grows with two Chinese strategic part owners”

  1. great news of course. but what does it mean for the plant and people in THN? will there be cars rolling off the line and if so, what brand will they be?

    • This is finaly the end for Saab cars. No more future. Sorry to write, but stupid swedish people… The main thief was Victor Muller. Today is the darkest day…

      • You cannot call Muller “the main thief”. If he/Spyker had not fought to buy Saab when GM wanted to shut it down, GM would have continued and shut Saab down at that point (just like they did with Saturn, Pontiac and Hummer). Victor Muller was not successful trying to keep Saab going, but he is hardly a “thief”.

    • NEVS. Maybe an e-vehicle w sophisticated intuitive interface, leasable battery pack, scandinavian design n safety, w chinese pricing, can compete.
      If the saab name is not available, then use the second best thing:
      Sonett 9x-turbo.

      • And sell them in China and ignore the rest of the planet? Unless us Saab fans learn Mandarin and move to China, this is hardly good news. And it probably won’t get off the ground anyway.

    • Live and let live. The road that NEVS is about will have less and less to do with SAAB cars. Perhaps someday an existing European car manufacturer will knock on the door of SAAB AB to license the brand name and logo. Until that happens I am quite happy with my new Benz. My good old SAAB went from Holland to the 2nd hand export market in Lithuania and today probably has a mysterious low millage on the clock 🙂

  2. Hiphip Hoera, and where is Saab in all this? Everybody is cheering but what with our beloved brand ? Awith As I understand it this is the end of Saab as a car brand.

    • Really?
      Rumours where talking about an agreement with a technology partner to develop the NEVS platform and build cars. This seems to be it. But I know, you where expecting something different based on vapour and rumours. People that still believe in SAAB as a car brand have to wait further till the talks with a new majority owner are finished.

      But hey, if you want, you can do as wfg.

    • I hope there is something true in this article while the announcement of NEVS today only speaks about the two Chinese partners which will invest in a factory in China.
      No word about the future of the facilities in Trollhattan nor about the community over there.
      I feel only bad about this announcement that seems probably a good financial deal but nothing good so far for Saabists in the world.

    • Something has happened overnight. The comments from Fredrik Sidahl has been completely removed from the news article, as well as from several other similar new articles in other newspapers (but the old versions are still visible through other services).

      I guess that means a confirmation of the message that there is no new majority owner and it seems that Nevs is basically reverting to something similar to their pre-Qingdoa business plan, as stated in this article that came this morning (swedish): http://ttela.se/ekonomi/saab/1.4014958-nyanstallningar-vantas-pa-nevs

  3. I have been hopeful for so long sorry to sound so negative but this is like watching someone in a deep coma who is probably going to die anyway is it just time to switch the “life” support off once & for all ?

  4. So Saab AB are going to approve a new Saab badged car ……. with the blowback from the previous failures not likely… maybe you should run a clone site called NEVS United …. and keep this site for just Saab owners it would work and keep the flame alight

        • Now your’re a bit unfair. the fact that NEVS hasn’t turned out to be what was hoped for (yet?) doesn’t mean they haven’t done anything. They have been keeping the Phoenix development going, and KJJ has put a fair amount of money into the business, although not high by automotive standards it’s still substantial amounts.

          Although the future may not look all that bright for the moment, there is still plenty of life. Which means that it’s far from that fat lady singing yet. A lot can happen in a few years.

  5. PEOPLE! ALERT!
    We need new Save Saab-campaing !!!
    Thats aint good future. I think right owner would be Koensignn! NEVS aint care Saab… 🙁 pls..

    • I’m sorry Juho, its not gonna happen… Save Saab worked because there was a clear enemy, this time the enemy is lack of money and lack of investors, how do you protest against that?

    • Juho, if You approach SAAB AB with a solid plan for making SAAB cars that plan better be more than solid. It will not happen for SAAB AB making cars was a parenthesis in the company. Now it is military equipment 100%.

  6. Here’s an important snippet from the SvD article on this story (in my translation):

    Why would the factory in Trollhättan still be kept when a new factory is being built in China?

    – We will have a global product range with two global production facilities. The factory in China will mainly supply the Chinese market, but gradually also start exporting. The factory here in Trollhättan will supply the rest of the world.

    • NEVS believe they can lease out production capacity to other carmakers. That will not happen if BMW needs more capacity they buy a factory or build a new one. They do not lease plants.

    • the factory in THN will supply [WHAT] to the rest of the world? as the situation is now, there will be no Saabs supplied from THN.

      tbfh: i don’t think the plant in THN will follow a similar construction (with whatever factory) as what BMW did with Mini and VDLNedcar. they (whoever ‘they’ may be) pulled the plug on Saab, and they have failed to put it back in.

  7. No mention of Saab & essentially no mention of Trollhattan. Seems bleak. I am forever hopeful, but this seems like the end. I desperately want to be proven wrong, however!

    Alas, my personal Saab saga is far from over. A Saab will be my daily driver for as long as it is practical. Within the next couple years, we will be adding one or two more to the family. And well into the future, they will be my summer weekend show cars. I’ll be attending my first Saab Owners Convention here in the USA this August. I still get my car serviced at my local former Saab dealer.

    Take care of your cars. Drive carefully. Get them washed regularly. Replace those faded emblems. Give a little nod or thumbs-up to fellow Saab drivers. May her spirit be long-lived.

    • Patrik H that is the right spirit. May we all cherish what we have and try to the the ones out there on the roads for as long time as possible. Renovate and pamper ALL Saabs they deserve it. I am happy having my 5 babies in the garage, But for daily chores I say get another good car there are a few brands that would appeal to Saab drivers.

      • There will certainly come a day when that is necessary. Hopefully the parts situation stays favorable for several more years. I’m excited about the return of Alfa Romeo in the US. They might be the eventual daily driver replacement. Fun to drive, quirky, driver-focused.

  8. Not drinking the Kool Aide here, but we are all used to waiting. And should maybe wait a bit longer. The other news article states they are planning on using Trollhattan for global purposes. And no official word has come about the use of the Saab name.
    If they did not get the Saab brand name, would they also have had to relinquish it by now, even on the Saabcars.com web page? News is slow in coming. Unfortunately, just going to try and wait a bit longer.

  9. My take on this is the same as 6 months ago…. I am not the least bit surprised by any of this.. Saab has been dead since Saab AB revoked the license.. Saab has been dead for a long long time its just official now like someone who was on life support but clinically dead.

    I suspect this business venture will die within 6 months, Nevs most likely will pump and dump everything it can in conjunction trying to squeeze as much cash out of new partners as possible to recoup previous losses. Another words skim as much cash as possible.

    Once all equipment and whatever else is sold from the plant the building will go up for sale and turned into a shipping / warehousing facility,,, like Tim said.

    I suspect with the final blow brought into light, parts will become scarce and some impossible to get.. If you don’t have deep pockets for parts sell now. We will begin to see greater depreciation for the cars we have like it couldn’t get worse,

    Sadly this is the end of a iconic brand may it rest in peace….

    • “My take on this is the same as 6 months ago….”

      Not quite. The difference is that somebody put up quite a bit of money, and is in discussions about the business plan with the new intended majority owner. This means two things, somebody trust Nevs to succeed enough to pay the bills for now, and that these new minority owners are unlikely to accept that nothing happens for an extended amount of time. And the new intended majority owner is not only still at the table, but involved in this step. So, I would say it’s likely that there will be a lot more activity fairly (well) soon.

      • Mailr

        Your way off if you believe a majority owner is coming related with Nevs and Saab,,, I suspect a law suite over the Qingdao 22 percent ownership is next will see… if a majority owner (real player) Oem was in play the deal would have been done a long time ago..

        Nevs and Saab is over, they have Zero relationship to the Saab brand… Why people can’t understand that is beyond me. Saab AB will never have a business relationship with NEVs…. hate that name.

        Saab is dead maybe years down the road someone will give it go and get the name… One thing is certain Nevs ain’t it.

        people can keep drinking the Kool Aid until they get sick and realize it won’t hep.

        • Yes, it seems like the new majority owner coming info was wrong, and Fredrik Sidahl at FKG was misinformed.

          Something seems to have happened fairly recently and that there has been a sharp turn in the direction the last few months. However, this also means that the conclusions over Nevs future from a few months ago may not be valid anymore, it’s a different ball game (that looks quite similar to the original pre-Qingdoa ball game). It’s far to early to say how this new game will pan out.

    • Doug: The problem with selling now is the cars are close to worthless. It almost makes more sense to just hold on and keep the cars on the road as long as possible and then if parts become impossible to find, give the car away at that point. The value of these cars was killed in 2012 when immediate steps weren’t taken to salvage the dealer network and have a firm plan to reenter global markets—-which would have kept dealers hanging in with the 9-3 line while new cars were being developed. Before that, the future was written when the eventual owner thought Saab should be an electric car company—-that’s when the trouble started.

  10. I find it comical how people try to read tea leaves here and jump to conclusions about a process they have no involvement in. If you look back at the comments from two years ago about NEVS, the conjecture, the total BS theories, and then you compare them to what has happened, they’re so off base with reality that it’s hard to comprehend. All the whining about NEVS’s ownership is so pointless because in the end, whether or not Saab lives or dies, it will be as a result of whatever process they’ve endured. I said it years ago when I stopped writing regularly and I’ll say it again, come back when there’s something to see here. Don’t worry about crafting a financial strategy to resurrect the company if you can’t directly or indirectly finance a reconstruction plan.

    If Saab gets the lifeline it needs, we’ll all be here to write about it. If not, SU will become a classics site. In the meantime, they’re locked in a holding pattern and there’s no point in making an ass of yourself by making blanket statements or predictions, criticizing the players, or rehashing the past. The only relevant news wasn’t even in this article, that the two Chinese investors are getting a “30% stake as part of the 200-million dollar deal” which was released here and as mentioned, here. Somehow Qingdao still has 22% of the company according to that article, which I’m not sure is true or not. In any event, patience and time are all that will bring news. This ain’t it folks.

    • Jeff,
      The big issue here is Qingdao. Do they still have their ownership stake? How could they, when they didn’t fulfill their obligation to NEVS? Of course, being China, who really knows. If they are still in it, then it is game over – 22% + 30% = no room for a new majority owner. Let’s hope they are out.

    • I think Jeff made a good point. There so little information that it is pointless to either being pessimistic or optimistic about the future of Saab as a brand or judging about the situation when so little is known.

      It sounds to me, and I can be completely wrong, that this is the first step to build up a new supply chain management structure that it will allow them to implement their business plan in the EV market. They need partners, either on the technological side or the financial side. This is the first step.

      We will see what it will be the second step. I think we should judge them whenever Nevs or Saab or whatever they are going to call it, it will release its first product.

    • A two hundred million dollar deal in the automotive industry. LMFAO that this is even news. Two hundred million dollars? A 30 second commercial during the 2015 Super Bowl cost advertisers 4.5 million dollars. The car companies advertised like crazy. 200 million? What will that go toward, hiring contractors to remove the Saab name from the factory in Sweden?

  11. Good news anyway, NEVS seems to have found some true partners for electric cars based on the… now old… Phoenix plate-forme. It does not mean anything bad nor good for Trollhättan facilities though. Something else could be announced afterwards ; wait and see.

    For those who still expected cars under SAAB name : Saab AB no longer seems to have any intention to grant licence for the name to be used as a car brand, the last hope has been definitively lost in early 2014. Does it really matter ? We still know nothing about these future cars, nor about the future brand name that would be placed on the bonnet. NEVS would be a nice name, as long as the Saab spirit is maintained.

  12. I would prefer NEVS dead and Kai Johan Jiang be back to China forever and do his stupid state budget-leaking-driven business there, where such business culture is a norm.

    The darkest day will be when I will have to change my SAAB to a diesel Audi. Maybe I should buy a convertible or something.

    • You don’t have to buy Audi like everybody. There are a lot of good cars out there which is not produced by VW or GM.

    • Eugene, Your darkest day is when you die. Hopefully you don´t ever sell your SAAB, like i will do. I will keep my SAAB´s until my last day on planet earth. This is not the end.It is the beginning of something new since Gasoline and Diesel engines will soon be forbidden in major Cities. France and England has already started to propose new regulations and electric cars is maybe the only choice so far. Cheer up and wait for THN-plant news from NEVS instead.

  13. Maybe Nevs should consider dropping the saab sticker all together.
    Its obvious that Nevs will have an evolving business plan, that will be based on what parterships they form, what financers they will attract. To let Saab AB define what Nevs should do, might be contraproductive, and prevent nevs to develop in à certain direction.

  14. The SAAB brand name is back in SAAB AB’s pocket. The licencing to NEVS was suspended many month ago. NEV’s no longer has the rights to manufacture/sell new products branded SAAB. (maybe they can still sell existing stock, but sooner or later, tha name will be taken off the website and Trolhattan’s walls).
    Teaming-up with an internet and e-commerce company wotnt get NEVS the brand name back. If I was NEVS i’d have consultants working on a new brand-name and brand-image right now.

    Second, teaming-up with more chinese semi-public companies won’t get NEVS closer to any kind of relationship with another car manufacturer. Anyone still believing this is a fool. Mahindra is out.

    And frankly, these aren’t speculation, it’s all cristal clear if you can read the signs.
    While I personally still had a tiny fraction of hope for SAAB as a carbrand, it evaporated yesterday.

    I think this time, the plug has (very sadly) been pulled on Saab Cars for a very very long time.

    2T

  15. IMHO NEVS has been consistent. This whole thing has been about Chinese Government money following a long-term vision to develop and supply the Chinese market with electric-powered personal transport. Their acquisition of Saab Cars, like their acquisition of Volvo, was simply about technology transfer. Why wait a generation to develop it themselves? And yes, they will have lost money, but how much would it have cost to have done all the development work themselves? In narrowly concentrating on their prime goal, they seem to have lost the opportunity to develop the brand. That might have been a tactical decision, but it might also have been due to communist aparachiks misunderstanding Western marketing principles and therefore just a lost opportunity.

    • Why do you care? Really, I’m seirous– are you a creditor? Do you have a personal stake in it? Does it hurt your feelings that NEVS may have defaulted? I’m curious. Why is this all so personal to you?

    • This deal means that NEVS now has 40 million USD in the bank. Of course this means that the creditors will get paid according to the composition agreement from March 23rd. The Vänerborg District Court has even appointed lawyer Lars Eric Gustafsson as a supervisor to make sure that everything is done according to the agreement.

  16. NEVS has been good at not making things public until they are set in stone and the things they have made public have so far turned out to be true and trustworthy. (We cannot blame NEVS for a previous partner comitting a breach of contract.) With that in mind I think that the interview at http://sverigesradio.se/sida/artikel.aspx?programid=125&artikel=6174888 gave good reasons to still hope for a bright future.

    Quick & Dirty translation of a few things said there in addition to what is already quoted above:

    “We will present more new partners. Both industrial partners (for sharing costs of development and getting lower costs for buying parts), technological partners (adding new technology that we and our customers need) and financial partners. New partners of all these three kinds will be presented.”

    “We announced in December that we had written an agreement (a so-called term sheet) with a new main owner. Now the preconditions have changed. We have left the reconstruction phase and secured stable funding with new shareholders, so the preconditions are different today, but our discussions with them [the new main owner] are continuing with the same goal: To secure a co-operation also with them.”

    “The Saab brand is very important for us as a company. The DNA is in the walls and important for Trollhättan. We have a dialogue with Saab AB, and these discussions we do directly with Saab AB.”

    “NEVS will develop and build electric cars in Trollhättan, but when we have unused capacity we can also build conventional cars for some of our partners. But our own cars will be electric.”

    So my interpretation is that the guys at NEVS are still working day and night to secure a bright future for car production in Trollhättan. They have also stated that they aim for premium and high tech cars, which is fine with me. Even if Saab is turbo-charged engines for many, I think that Tesla has shown that their cars are today what cars with turbocharged engines once were, so I really think that is the right way to go. Environment friendly cars for everybody, and for those that wants fast acceleration etc, there’s plenty of that too.

    So only good news from NEVS in the last days from my point of view. 🙂

    • Given their short range 100% EV’s today are still niche. If an EV is environmental friendly are you are stating depends on more than what you yes or no put in the tank. Two main factors are: (1) On what is the local electricity plant running? Charcoal and especially brown coal are killing for the environment. (2) The total life cycle of a car from cradle to the grave. Which materials are needed to built it? Where do these come from? What’s the lifespan? How is the recyclability? It’s about time the whole subject of eco-friendly is being approached scientifically rather than emotionally. Today we all limit ourselves looking at the end-product. Without have a clue on the carbon footprint of the total life cycle. That goes for EV’s but also for bio fuels, bio plastics, paper disposables etc.

  17. Mattias Bergman said in an interview with TTELA, that there is no longer a new owner coming in, but new “partners”.
    To me it is a confirmation that NEVS will pursue “the Chinese- electric” track and that “SAAB” is out.

    • If you compare with the statement to the court in mid April, this is a definite change. Which means that the path forward has changed very recently, and as the change of direction is still young, all answers are most certainly not in yet. We have to wait and see (hmm, heard that one before?)

      • People are no longer waiting to see—-they’ve moved on. For crying out loud, TIM moved on! We got a new owner in 2012 and they weren’t up to the task. They failed. Apparently they’ve failed again in selling to someone who would NOT be a failure. So here we are, and it does finally look like an ending is being written. Doug R. was right a long time ago—-the patient might have been dead even though some stubborn doctors were not giving up. At this point, I think the doctors have thrown in the towel and now we’re just waiting for the coroner to confirm the time of death and the cause of death.

        • It seems like this is deja vu all over again! $200 million is chicken feed, really. It might keep the lights on and pay the debt installment but beyond that it is not going to provide enough capital to launch a product cycle. I doubt it could even finance cranking out the current 9-3 in electric form. If there is not a new majority owner, I don’t see how this makes any sense going forward.

          The only thing I can see is that it provides these new investors the ability to access technology and then develop their own product and production capacity separately, as some above indicated.

          Its also ironic that Chinese investors are now in the picture as that is what GM objected to when Muller was trying to get his financing together back when (if I remember correctly).

          I am growing weary of this limp-along mode. I don’t see much “Saab” in this whole thing, and I think it is wishful thinking to expect Saab vehicles to be produced again. SAAB AB would be insane to agree to license the name to yet another consortium of Chinese quasi-public/private firms. If Mahindra had stepped in a bought the whole damn thing, then maybe it would make sense.

          I really find this all very annoying at this point. Interesting, but annoying.

        • You’re right Angelo Nevs wouldn’t sell or relinquish to a major,,, My take is they want to get there loses back anyway possible,, Pump and dump skim whatever means possible.. Stage one was getting out of 50% of past due payables.

          That wouldn’t have happened with a real OEM…. They figured they had the plant as leverage..

          Just my opinion… Ironically this is a similar deal that supposedly cost them like before..with Qingdao, Yet Qingdao still retains 22 percent … HMMM can someone say law suite… Maybe Nevs breached for under performance…

          • Doug: You really should consider a career in investigative journalism. Former KC Chiefs, Buffalo Bills and CFL football coach Marv Levy once told me—-good journalists have the ability to look into the heart of a matter from a distance. I think you’ve consistently done that for the last couple years.

            • Thanks Angelo lol,,, not quite just insight from my past business experience…. Its obvious to anyone with experience how this has played out. its been disheartening for sure.

              Went car shopping yesterday for my wife,, while I was parked I got several compliments on my 93 from people at the dealership.. My car looks virtually brand new.

              The subcompact segment is loaded with some really nice cars,, my wife ended up with a new Corolla S plus with convenience package.. Leather interface radio, Nev 17 inch wheels,, paddle shifters you name it.. Super White silver black alloys..

              Our Saab cars from a material stand point have fallen way behind… We tested Honda, Mazda, Kia, Toyota,,, She loved the Toyota for room and smoother ride… The Mazda 3 was hot in my opinion just more aggressive.and sporty… The Toyota had a sporty drive in the S plus package just not as harsh.
              Retail on the Toyota set up $23,300..

              • I like that KIA Forte 5. I don’t think they’re quite up to Toyota standards in quality/longevity, but they’re really nice cars. At some point, when I begin replacing my current fleet, I’ll look hard at KIA. And if I decide I want a reliable compact as one of my vehicles—-a Corolla might just win out too.

  18. Niklas G

    All lip service Saab is with Saab AB its over.. Nevs will never get a real OEM partner that would entice Saab AB… A Real Oem is any major car maker. People make me laugh….

    • +1 How could a Western OEM ‘partner’ protect its technology from simply finding its way straight to the Chinese automobile industry? GM did have a point.

  19. Scepticism and even negativism is fine with me. But why keep on being sarcastic towards those of us still believe (who of us that doesn’t belong to the inner circle of peopla at NEVS, can really know for sure) that something good will come out from this. Yes, I agree. This is a difficult situation. But according to ttela the workers at NEVS are happy. Mattias Bergman claims that they have a dialogue with SAAB AB about the brand name, he talk about EVs and as I recieve it, the incoming OEM is not definitely out, even if the letter of intent from December, is not valid any more. Yet, what now happened is far more better than the worst scenario; there is no bankruptcy, the plant in Trollhättan is loaded with engineers and workers, and NEVS actually finalized an agreement with two partners. Thus, I am sure, we haven’t seen it all yet. Concerning my fingers. I can only hold them around the steering wheel, which I suppose will be in a (daily driver) SAAB for the foreseeable future. In some five years or so, I have no problem to switch my petrol cars to EVs, if that is feasible. Sure, it will not be the same if they are not labeled SAAB..

    • When you say that plant in Trollhattan is “loaded” with engineers and workers, what number are we talking about? How is NEVS continuing to pay a load of engineers and workers while they are stiffing their creditors?

      • “Loaded” is maybe not the best word. But lets face it. The situation during the last year have been very severe, and NEVS were in reconstruction for quite a long while. I have to admit, I thought NEVS/saab car would finally disappear. So compared with a bankruptcy and a definite end of the saab saga, NEVS have left reconstruction, they have some 300 persons or so, on their payroll list and they have agreements with two other significant “players”. All this must indicate something. With last year in perspective, I think this is an achievement. At least, my expectations have risen.

  20. Well said and I fully agree.
    Most major “luxury” car brands are now working furiously on EV development which is obviously the future.
    The range of the EV is getting better and better as time passes. The power/torque is phenomenal.
    I would love a TESLA type SAAB.
    I think NEVS is on the right course and in fact will enable SAAB to continue as a brand leader and innovator.

    • “enable SAAB to continue as a brand leader and innovator”?
      Jasper, I must ask…are your fingers crossed so tightly it’s impeded critical blood flow?

        • I agree with you on that. Considering that almost everyone visiting and commenting here are Saab enthusiasts, bordering on rabid Saab maniacs—-we have all been under a lot of stress for at least seven years now. It’s not only loving the brand—-and not knowing if there’s a future—-but it’s also seeing our cars resale value plummet, some people upside down on loans, losing warranty coverage, etc. This is personal to a lot of people. Yet through it all, I think we’ve been incredibly respectful toward each other even when we have diametrically opposed opinions about Saab and NEVS. I think the comic relief is welcome though—-I love Joe’s comments. For me, the most frustrating thing is thinking about “what could have been.” It wouldn’t be so bad if something was happening—-something, ANYTHING. Even if it was a march toward Saab EVs (which I think would be a disaster for Saab car fans) at least we’d see a product pipeline—-Saab would be in the news—-the company would still be viable. I’d disagree with the idea, but at least there’d be something somewhat positive happening. Instead, we have zilch. Little scraps of news every two months that have been mostly negative or meaningless. It’s really the pits right now to be a fan of Saab cars. And when I think of what might have happened in early 2012, I think we’d see spy photos of new 2016 Saabs on the horizon if a different company had stepped in instead of NEVS. When it went to NEVS and I heard what they were planning, I knew we were dead in the water. And we are.

        • Agreed Jasper. Attitudes are like car brands- some good and some bad. And some people here have gone from being negative to displaying bad attitudes. The auto industry suffers loss sometimes. But its sad to see people losing out on being people at their best. We need to work on relationships first and wory about cars after that

    • I strongly urge you to look for today’s Los Angeles Times article “Elon Musk’s Growing Empire” to get an insight into the genius. Bottom line: He’s received 4.9 BILLION dollars in government loans—-for his various clean and green projects—-almost 5 billion dollars in loans—-and has not turned a profit yet on these enterprises. My point? My point isn’t to disparage Mr. Musk, who I do respect as a brilliant man. But my point is that this belief that EVs are the future is unfounded. Apparently, Tesla is the gold standard, right? They are the “Luxury EV company” and they’re being propped up by taxpayers, not customers—-and they can’t make a profit to save their life. What financial institution would loan Musk this type of money? Answer? None. That’s where the government comes in. They can let people blow through billions of dollars with no accountability. Read the article. To the extent that BMW and others are dabbling in EVs or even feverishly developing them—-this isn’t new. We’ve been hearing about the electric car for decades now and certainly, the chatter has picked up since the 21st century began. Billions and billions of dollars have been spent on this—-government has gone out of their way to encourage EV and hybrid sales with fat tax incentives and things like allowing use of high occupancy vehicle lanes by single commuters—-if they’re in the pet vehicle. I see that people have adapted to hybrids—-I have a company Prius myself. But plug-ins have not gotten traction yet. If consumers are FORCED to this, I guess it’ll happen. As long as the market can decide, it’s a total folly. EVs are not as good as gas and diesel vehicles for the vast, vast majority of car owners. That’s just a fact. There’s plenty of oil for our needs for many decades to come. We know that. Cars can also be made to run on natural gas—-down the road, perhaps fuel cells. The idea of herding us to EVs that we don’t want—-that don’t meet our needs—FORCING us is the only way this is going to happen. It’s a power struggle and if they win, they win—hurray for them. But make no mistake about it—-left to our own choices, we will continue to see what the current market is showing us. EVs are a loser. It’s even questionable (as pointed out by others on this site numerous times) how environmentally positive they are anyway. You still pollute when you use electric (in most places). China’s old fashioned coal fired plants are how those cars are going to “recharge.” And as we see, the predictions of “fast growth for EVs in China” has turned out to be a joke anyway. They aren’t wasting their resources on this nonsense yet.

      • Bravo Angelo! But you’re fighting widespread dogma’s. Fed by NGO’s and paid with taxes. As a consequence the public opinion on EV’s is based on emotion rather than the scientific proof of environmental claims. As a result the car industry is now designing, manufacturing and selling towards government tax rules. The government has become the “free” market demand.

      • Guys: As I recall, the article said that the income for Tesla drivers averages $320,000 a year. This is a complete joke—-insanity. Why in the world is the government subsidizing a rich man who is making toys for rich people? Next up is the Tesla SUV, which is sure to cost about the same as the Model S. They have a timeline on that. They don’t appear to have a timeline on the “affordable EV” that they’ve been promising since they introduced the $80,000+ Model S. It’s starting to look like a scam.

  21. Hi, I am new here…. In my opinion, NEVS techincly ruined Saab with their EV thing. Who would want an Electric Saab? Saab’s were ment to be turbocharged and fun to drive. Making the current 9-3 an EV will make it no better than a Prius! And NEVS is why they have no investor? Wow. If they want to be sucesefull, they should change their name from NEVS to Swedish Automobile AB or something and make real Saab’s. I’m not saying that they should not make EV or hybrid cars, but they should also offer regular petrol/diesel cars and make real Saab’s that are turbocharged. If they do that, they will be in a better position now. That’s my take on the whole NEVS thing.

    • Welcome Nicholas and thank you for your comment. You’re right—-it was and is a bad idea—-electric cars primarily for the Chinese market. For the life of me, I can’t figure out why this guy targeted Saab to attempt this scheme. Seems there would have been cheaper and easier ways for him to build golf carts for China—-we all know he would have moved production from Sweden to China anyway. Now he’ll end up losing the Saab name too. This was a non-starter. It made no sense then and it makes less sense now.

      • Thanks Angelo. Another thing that doesn’t make sense is why NEVS spend so much time on developing an EV if they already had the Epower hybrid from 2011 already developed? NEVS should first work on finishing up the 9-3 Phoenix and make a dealer network to sell them. They offer a regular ICE engine. After they have sales, then they could offer a hybrid/electric. NEVS is trying to run before walking in my POV. Plus, I heard that Tesla is going to release a cheap car around 45k. How is a Chinese Saab going to compare to a Tesla.for the same price? I wonder on how all this is going to play out

        • Tesla seems to have that 45K EV on the back burner. They don’t even have a “target date” spelled out at this time. Right now, their priority seems to be an SUV that will probably sell in the same neighborhood as the Model S. Tesla hasn’t made profits. Their stock has been bid up on “expectations” and Elon Musk, a very smart businessman, is also a great carnival barker. They’re not making a profit yet—-they are getting all sorts of government money and assistance—-but honestly, they’ve done nothing in terms of a clean energy transportation breakthrough for average car buyers. We’re looking at luxury performance vehicles for the rich right now—nothing more/nothing less. I’m much more impressed with the Model T and original Volkswagen Beetle, not to mention the Toyota Corolla.

          • What Tesla have done is shown what level of battery and charging capacity, as well as what infrastructure, is needed make an electric car usable as a replacement for an ICE car, i.e. what is the minimum technical spec needed. If the price of the car is a reasonable or if it’s good business is different thing.

            • Actually, what they have shown is that even if you spend eighty thousand U.S. dollars, the vehicle you’re buying isn’t capable of long distance driving without serious inconvenience and trip interruptions, along with the anxiety that goes with running out of “energy” on the side of the road and needing to be towed instead of having a gallon of gas delivered. The Chevy Volt is superior technology for people who need an all purpose vehicle and who are concerned about being stranded by the EV.

              • Well, that’s one way to put it. However, Teslas ARE capable of long distance driving with, for some people, reasonably inconvenience and a , also for some people, reasonable amount of anxiety. It also shows that most people most likely want a range extender for now.

                The thing with the Tesla though, is that in some cases is within shouting distance of an ICE. Depending on how high you shout…

  22. Welcome, Nicholas, to this slightly crazy (at least in my case) group of pontificators! It’s a good question about the name of NEVS. Makes one hit the re-set button after all of the stuff that has gone on over the past 4 years. The article about the Saab engine being in a BAIC design reminds me that BAIC got the rights to the 9-3 and 9-5 architecture a few years ago and has been making their version of those vehicles since (or at least they had been). So, to Angelo’s point, why did NEVS’ original owners target Saab in the first place since a Chinese competitor had basically the same thing and could have developed an electric version of the 9-3 for that market? The fact they didn’t do that makes a pretty clear statement about the need for them there, at least in the near future.

    I think electric vehicles do have a role to play in the future once there is suitable development in the battery/storage department. Had that development continued in tandem with other developments in the auto industry over the past 100 years, we would be in a much different position now. Remember that, 100 years ago, electric vehicles were very popular, at least in the US, and they actually had pretty good performance for the time. And also consider that even Formula 1 teams are using essentially (very complex) hybrid powertrains. True EV vehicles still have a pretty harsh market environment to deal with, but the use of supplemental electric motors in the auto industry is clearly a continuing trend.

    You think the kick of a turbo is fun, try nearly instant torque! Yee-haw! (I am from Missouri)

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